Christian God theme debunked.

If a discussion turns into a debate it is typically because one of the discussors feels as though he or she must defend his or her belief. This does not mean that they feel as though they must be in control, this means that they feel their Way of understanding is being challenged.

You are correct to say that no one person will ever be correct but through understanding and cooperation we can come to know truth and that is what matters.

Every human being has a right to form their own opinions however they please. If one wishes to follow Buddha does this make them any more incorrect than one who follows Jesus? Of course not. However an opinion fostered in ignorance is an opinion that is lacking. By the same token an opinion based in knowledge is an opinion that is being grown. Once an ignorant opinion is given the water of knowledge it can then be harvested and will aid others in their opinions as well. Perhaps instead of trying to belittle others you should instead seek to understand their points of view and try to acknowledge the areas within that you can benefit from.

Matthew 7: 3-5
"Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? How can you say to your brother, 'Let me take the speck out of your eye,' when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye.

 

Perhaps take things with a grain of salt.

If we do well are we not rewarded?

 

Is the coming of wisdom not it's own reward?

 

In fact, we are our own reward.

 

Even me Happilyinlove?

Will it change your opinion if I say you have pretty fingers---and very lovely fingernail polish?

But seriously---none of us will ever be right because we can only see through our own eyes and from our own perspective. And we can only experience the divine within a very intimate corner of our soul---even if we sometimes share that in a collective sense with a group---it is still experience from the intimacy of our own soul.

I can try to see through your eyes. Maybe I will learn from it, or maybe it will change my opinion, but then again, maybe I will stick to what my opinion. But I will never try to change your beliefs. And even if it was to worship a daisy and you asked me my opinion of that----I would say, "good for you." (And the difference between that Daisy and any one of us, is that it has not alienated itself from its essence----it is still living in the divine (But that is just my opinion).

 

Not everyone cares for it preferring comfort at all costs. I seek it urgently obviously it is of value to me.

 

What is most important is that it gives meaning to our lives and gives us direction. And that we have the faith within that belief to call for help when we need it.

 

No, not you. I'm more referring to the battle over it. I don't see you battling or trying to change my opinion.


To all, its ok to respectfully agree to disagree. In fact, you weaken your own argument by attempting to tear each other down with hurtful words. I was more or less joking by calling people freaking nutsos - and notice I would be calling myself that as well since I participated.

When this discussion has more content, and less of the battle of wills, I'll come back to it. Peace out.

Oh and thanks for the nail compliment

 

Obviously we are speaking of content we agree with as I am content to remain.

 

I would not be surprised if this was stated before but I think that the point to be praised of Jesus' torture and crucifixion was that it was done out of love, mercy, and grace. Granted my knowledge of Christian thinking is a bit off beat with current ideals. Still though that would explain why it is praised. Also most Christians don't actually worship God, they think they do, but in reality they are worshipping Jesus and his Way.

 

Ok well as soon as I say I want content, some content comes along.

This is true. But remember we believe Jesus is Lord. Ahem…the trinity

 

Indy,

I would not take anything away from what Jesus did. If he did it to help move humankind a step forward rather than a step back, then that is the most selfless act I can think of. My disagreement with fundamentalist christians is that they attribute the crucifixion to something God ordered as a ransom to be paid for leniency toward humanity. Ransom is a term usually reserved for terrorists.

 

It wasn't God who ordered his crucifixion. It was the people.

 

Believe what you will but please remember the Trinity is not a true Christian doctrine. It is an idea borrowed from other far older faiths such as Hinduism and Paganism. In point of fact; if asking a Jew about the Trinity they would call it blasphemy. To say that a man is God incarnate directly defies the commandment in Exodus 20: 4-6 “You shall not make for yourself an image in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below. You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me, but showing love to a thousand generations of those who love me and keep my commandments."

 

Happily',

Are you saying that the crucifixion was not necessary to God's willingness to forgive human sin?

 

Right, the bible doesn't say "God exists in a trinity". It doesn't say it explicitly but its evident many times over in the text. Thats why we believe in the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. If God isn't the Holy Spirit than who is? haha

 

The bible doesn't actually refer to the Holy Spirit until the New Testament, at least not in the original Hebrew translation. Also if you refer in part to the verse in
Genesis 1: 26 Then God said, “Let us make man in our image, after our likeness. And let them have dominion over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the heavens and over the livestock and over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth.”
I would have to also remind you that in the original translation the word our is used in the non-gender duality context. This can later be seen in the context of one of God's names Elohim. The im within the name is a denotation of the same. In other words when God uses our, ours, and us He is referring to the duality presented within Himself, the duality of male and female.

 

Always seeming to find myself in a position that makes me seem arrogant but even so, the reason that "fundamentalist" Christians believe this is because of the doctrine of original sin that has been spread throughout the modern Christian world.

 

I think one misunderstanding people generally have is that God orchestrates everything in our lives. Like, he is always responsible for the good and bad that we encounter. When in reality he gives us a choice.

God didn't invoke evil into the people and suggest they kill him. He gave his son to the earth to enlighten them and bring them to faith, teach them and help them. For this he was persecuted (for reasons like greed, power etc. I mean some people really liked Jesus and he posed a threat to wickedness).

Jesus never hesitated to preach despite threats, so he also knew he was going to be crucified. He felt so strongly that his purpose was to teach and help that he would do so despite any harm it would bring about him in the worldly sense: i.e. being stoned, crucified, ridiculed.

Jesus said the following:

John 10:14:18
“I am the good shepherd; I know my sheep and my sheep know me— just as the Father knows me and I know the Father—and I lay down my life for the sheep. I have other sheep that are not of this sheep pen. I must bring them also. They too will listen to my voice, and there shall be one flock and one shepherd. The reason my Father loves me is that I lay down my life—only to take it up again. No one takes it from me, but I lay it down of my own accord. I have authority to lay it down and authority to take it up again. This command I received from my Father.”

The command being a choice to live by the will of God, which means you do not denounce him or put yourself before him for any reason.

 

Yeah, some people don't even give God credit for being at least as reasonable as a human; that is, most people wouldn't condemn the children for what their parents have done.