God and Satan would be on the same side then... wouldnt they?

if u want to beleive that he chose for eveil to exist:God chose for evil to exist to test us, to push us to see how much we truly love Him, he gave us the choice to sin, just as He gives us the choice whether or not we want to Love and follow Him, its all our choice, because, its not realy his fault that Lucifer fell, he got greedy and wanted to be God, and there iis only one God, he wasnt just gonna give up his throne to an angel, we serve Him not the other way around, so as a rebellion, Lucifer became evil, because God cast him down, and um I dont think he liked that very much, so he decided to become Gods enemy, instead of trying to become him, and then got a bunch of angels to fall, not quite sure how he did that but he did, thats y we have demons, so u see, the kingdom of darkness, is just a bunch of fallen angels, as is satan, but becuase of this, GOd had to give up his son so we could all live in eternity with Him, well his followers neways, those who reject Him wont go, but u know, this is my take on that whole ordeal. I am a christian and I know a whole lot about this, my parents are in counseling and minisrty, and i ahve seen alot of things, so i am confident in my beleifs, even when iu srtay from them and :try" to beleive sumtin else, i cant ! the truth is like burned into me, its the way i was raised!

 

well let me ask u this, when u were little and u did something wrong, didnt ur parents punish u?

 

i tihnk this has been brought up in previous threads [like a loooong while ago], but i don't know if it was ever answered, or if it was i forgot it, but---where does the rebellion in heaven story come from? does it have any basis in scripture?

 

Satan hates Gods creation. He knows the only way he can hurt God is to harm the very thing God loves the most. God has given us a way to avoid Satan through His Son Jesus Christ. Yet, this world does not want God's Son or His love. P.S. Get another youth pastor.

 

Interestingly enough, today I read in a book I recently bought, a collection of works by Kahlil Gibran (poet, writer), a story that applies to this thread. His stuff is often mystical/philosophical (and I highly recommend him, here's a site with all his stuff online, for free: http://leb.net/gibran/ )

Anyways... there was a story called "Satan" where he basically, through a sort of allegorical tale, gives the idea that Satan is there for a measuring stick by which God can judge us; also, Satan is what promotes all what we call civilization: all the scholarly study, great art and achitecture, etc... Satan has also greatly enhanced our lives, by showing us the bad, that we may know and understand the good. It's not a very long story, so here's a link to it: http://leb.net/gibran/works/satan.html

 

Isaiah 14:12-15 Old Testament

"How are thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how are thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congreation, in the sides of the north: I wil ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High. Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit."

It is believed that about one third of all the angles in heaven sided with Satan when this all happened. There is more about the story throughtout the Bible.
http://www.bible.com/answers/asatan.html

 

thank you campbell--i had always thought it was one of those things that had no place in scripture, yet was taught dispite that--thank you for that

 

Old Testament Isaiah 14:12-15 "How are thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High. Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit."

If you ever read the Bible God is not pleased with Satan, and his future will be pretty dim. But then you really have to read the Book to understand this.

 

this is how satan decieved the whole world - jesus gets reincarnated -comes back as the devil because he lost his identity -but he awakens and quits sinning then you have the 2nd coming of christ - a great mystery you just gotta know how to read it

 

i like this topic

 

oh my, i just saw that chuck when you seperated it out

"oh my"--that is all i can say

 

i like the way you are expressing it

 

I'm stoned, but I'll do the best I can.

Alright here goes. Lucifer hates man, he hates them because right after the beginning God decreed that angels should now bow to man. Lucifer refuses. There are two theories to why.

1. Lucifer did not see why he a superior son of fire, should bow before a sun of nothing more than dust. He found it insulting that in all his power that he should bow before such a fragile, shorted lived, bio-dependent creature.

2. Lucifer loved God more than all the other angels did. He simple could not have any affection that would take away from his affection towards God.

Either way Michael throws Lucifer out, even though Lucifer is more power Michael manages to rip off Lucifer's right wing and cast him into the skies, where one winged he could not keep from plumeting towards Earth.

But Lucifer knew a why that could prove that he was right and that God should be the only loved one, which supports the 2nd theory. Or the one that supports the first theory, he was pissed and wanted revenge.

So Lucifer tempts Eve to eat the apple so that she's gain disfavor to God and Lucifer will say "See, you command all your angels to bow before them and this is how they repay you."
However the Lord did not buy it and Lucifer got really angry. He thought "I merely choose not to worship and I'm cast out, and yet not only does he show these humans more than he has ever shown us, but he gives them patience. Another thing he lacked to express to us angels."
Lucifer wanted them to pay for having the favor that he felt only his kind should have. But he knew that if man followed a life after God than they would go to heaven where he couldn't touch them.
So he divised a new method. Make everyone he could gain disfavor in God's eyes!!
And that's what happened, even Jesus's death didn't fully correct the issue, because people are infused with free will, making their minds and spirits fully theirs. So they have to choose willing to take Jesus's gift of salvation.

And everyone who falls short of that gift of salvation, or the old sacrifices (doves and stuff), whichever one they prefer, if they don't fulfill them than they go to hell, where Lucifer tortures them for payback on having God's favor.

And what's the best way to reject God? By making man experience the fun that he'll lack if he chooses to follow him.

 

Well that thought did not come from the Bible, perhaps Hollywood.

 

Yes, I would say you are reading the Hollywood version.

 

to be honest, I dont care, i just like the thought.. couse IM atheist in your case.. and Pagan as well.. proud to be it, tho i love Nature and Thara..
And I love the thought Heru was wxpressing, is there something wrong? or i must study the bible by heart to come here and say what I like and dislike?

 

the temptation of jesus in the wilderness by the devil is actually to be read as a prophecy - i can explain turn a stone into bread - the stone the builders refused is satan -jesus is the bread- turn the stone into bread - and the rest explains itself. the part about the dead will rise in christ first -it means satan - people dont magicly get raptured to heaven-they have to die in the end of the world with every one else-the false prophets really went wild with there interpetations- but the bible tells the truth jedi mind tricks are in the bible people alpha and omega - first and last comon folks - rev i am the root of david and the bright morningstar- lucifer=the planet venus when it is the morningstar- you just gotta know how to read it satan tricked you

 

read 2 chapter of 2 thessalonians and it explains it all

 

So you worship the creation rather than the Creator. And your proud to be a Pagan. Well remember what the Book says about that. Pride goes before a fall. Actually to study the Bible might not be a bad idea. I have done that myself from time to time, and was shocked to find out what was in there. I learned a lot of things they never told me in Sunday School class. You can come hear and say what ever you like, I was just making a comment. See I'm pretty serious about the Bible. It's the only Book I know of that writes history before it happens. And it appears that before my generation dies off, all those Bible prophecies are going to be fufilled. The Jews are not back in Israel by accident.