Hinduism and other Faiths

the use of solar disc has two meanings here... by perception it appears to be a disc (circular flat object) but it is actually a round shaped as a ball self-illuminating heavenly body as a result of nuclear fission and fusion of hydrogen, helium ... iskconers on the other hand believe as a.c. swami told them that the sun is actually a golden wheel (or disc) on vivasvan's chariot as it circles mount meru as described in the bhagavatama... and unto this, the sun or vivaswan's chariot wheel is the only illuminating body in the universe and all what we call stars are in actuallity planets that reflect sunlight... the twinkling effect of them according to a.c. swami is from their being heavenly planets and they twinkle from all the precious gems there and so folks like to twist themselves into a pretzel to get there... i've haven't met any of these people yet but swami talks about them

it is helpful to know of the literal interpretation of myths by a.c. swami and his disciples to have a grasp of their vedic science

 

no, you want to be a parrot... take some time to understand and not just repeating what others have told you is the truth

 

At the surface, perhaps, but underneith....they are the same...they are both of the same essence. Isn't that the point? We all look the same and have different paths, choices, ect but in the end we are all part of One.

 

In a way they are the same, but there is a distinction. Ramakrishna seems to imply two phases of the divine - the passive, un-manifest Brahman, and the active, manifest Shakti. This is illustrated in some depictions of Shiva/Shakti where Shakti is shown dancing on the chest of the sleeping Shiva.

He is saying that the way to the un-manifest is through the manifest, through union with the Shakti.
Shakti incidentally, equates with Maya.

Obviously, all this is metaphor. In fact, the sun can't be separeted from its radiation. It's what the Buddhists call the principle of the simulataneously arising.

 

In 'Beelzebub's Tales to his Grandson', Gurdjieff says the sun is a ball of ice.

 

amen.

 

So sure that you are not doing exactly the same thing? .

Hare krishna .

 

When the manifest world is concerned, there is no doubt there is duality, there is multiplicity even. Of course. It is only in the state of transcendence, where we deal with the substratum of both the manifest world, and prakriti maya, then we come to the nondual brahman.

 

Hare Krishna!

Nothing like being a parrot to repeat :

Hare Krishna! Hare Krishna! Hare Krishna!
Jaya Radhe! Jaya Radhe! Jaya Radhe!

It gives bliss and does not matter who,when, said it first.


The sun is like a disc, wheel or ball or whether it is cold or hot.... Nama is eternal which will never rot. Better be a Nama-repeating parrot.


Love,

Kumar.

 

so many words.......

 

i'm kinda glad i was outta town for this one. what is the point in arguing over metaphors? how can you base your arguments on interpretation? what have you all experienced to be true? personally, i'm enlightenment impaired. i've got no clue, other than a few experiences that have forced me to open my eyes a little wider. i don't understand the validity in entrusting your path to the written word, especially when most of it points out that you must know yourself to progress. i think we're all guilty of trying to be right a lot of the time, and i don't think the people who lived thousands of years ago were any better about that.

 

In many cases they were considerably worse.

 

You are absolutely right

 

ChiefCowpie;
a parrot will repeat anything anyone says indiscriminately. a politician will hear a truth and twist it to make a point, and lose it's original form. i might occasionally do both, but i try my hardest to do neither. one of the flaws of our material existence is our desire to be independent, an individual, at the cost of logic and truth. we won't say or do a thing, or we will act in a certain way, just to do something we think has never been done before, to make ourselves feel special. how can you surrender to krishna while still feeding your own ego? there's a balance between being self centered and being a drone with no personality. but we don't need to be insecure, and think that if we give up the things that make us feel important, like reinterpreting things and putting them through our own filter, that we won't be our distinct selves. the personality is still there.

you know how in school, sometimes you'd have to give a report on something, and some people would just copy what someone else said, changing a few words and reorganizing the structure so it's not plagiarized? with the vedas, and with prabhupada's books, or with any message of krishna, we don't need to do that. that's why prabhupada's translation of the bhagavad gita is "as it is"; because so many people alter it, and if you alter something enough, it's original form is totally lost. so better i be a parrot and repeat krishna consciousness as i've heard it, than i be a politician and use it for my own propaganda. i'm not telling you MY own knowledge, my own set of values i formed in this lifetime. i'm just relaying the words that were passed down directly from god to the best of my ability.


please keep in mind that i know i'm flawed, and i apolagize for anything i've said that is offensive or pretentious. hare krishna.

 

Hare Krishna!



Prismatism said.....
.......repeat krishna consciousness as i've heard it, than i be a politician and use it for my own propaganda. i'm not telling you MY own knowledge, my own set of values i formed in this lifetime. i'm just relaying the words that were passed down directly from god to the best of my ability.
please keep in mind that i know i'm flawed, and i apolagize for anything i've said that is offensive or pretentious. hare krishna.
_________


Prismatism, dear soul,

Please repeat Krishna or any other name of God that you know of. Let the Consciousness be your own.

So far all yogis, sadhus and avatars have talked about Brahman and consciousness but nobody could describe the knowledge of the divine consciousness. As it is indescribable.

Let this knowledge come to you and be very much your own.

Love,

Kumar.

 

prismatism, going by your definitions, i would conclude that a.c. swami was a politician who had human flaws and who brought his agenda and altering to bhagavada gita


all in all, i respect and honor the man who inspired so many people to take up the path of self understanding... god realization of which i hope folks don't stop the search with his limited and biased conclusions

 

How could you surrender to Krishna or indeed any other divine form if you had no ego - no sense of a separative existence? To surender implies one who surrenders and that which is surrendered to.

As to 're-interpretation' - Prabhupada denies that he interprets, but in fact he does interpret. He interprets along the lines of Gaudiya Vaishnavism with which he'd been exclusively conditioned from childhood, and in accord with his own personality - that of a somewhat uptight religious fanatic.
Try looking over other commentaries on the Gita, and you'll find that actually, he ignores a great deal of the message, interpreting it along the lines of one particular school of theistic philosophy. And in a way very un-characteristic of Indian teachers in general, he's rather nasty towards anyone who holds a different tradition or interpretation.

Stuff like belief that the moon is further away than the sun are simply remnants of a medieval world view which evolved in a pre-scientific age.

We don't have to be tied to all that in order to know the divine. We have no choice but to look critically at the words of gurus like SP, or else believe in stuff that is frankly laughable.

 

Hare Krishna!


````````````````````````````````````````````````` Originally posted by ChiefCowpie :

.........all in all, i respect and honor the man who inspired so many people to take up the path of self understanding... god realization of which i hope folks don't stop the search with his limited and biased conclusions.
`````````````````````````````````````````````````

Very good! That is exactly how we should go about it.

 

I'd substitute evangelist for politician, and conclusions of his spiritual tradition (madhva-sampradayda) for agenda and altering. Dualism and theism have very long histories in Indian spiritual thought ...they're not something cooked up by Srila Prabhupada and his immediate predecessors and contemporaries.

Agree 100%...All Glories to Srila Prabhupada!

 

No problem with that. I have nothing but respect for Ramanujacharya and Madhavacharya, the pioneers of vishitadvaita and dvaita philosophies. Both were great sages, who wrote excellent and beautiful commentaries on upanishads and other scriptures, as well as their own books.
My problem with SP, is that he is offensive and disrespectful to other great masters who disagree with him. He even selectively quotes Shankaracharya, attempting to make it seem as though he was also propogating duality.
I have no problem with dualistic interpretations of scripture, which are legitimately possible from a certain standpoint, but when the language is twisted and incorrectly translated to suit a philosophical agenda, that is definitely wrong. And that is greatly magnified by the fact that a vast majority of his followers don't know sanskrit and therefore have no way of knowing that he was doing that.
Further his frankly idiotic theories regarding science and interplanetary travel reduce him to ridiculous in my opinion, showing he is unable to think beyond the literal word of Srimad bhagavatam and resorting to "because the book says so" justification for his beliefs. Anytime he is challenged, all the interviews I have seen or read show him browbeating the person rather than providing a clear explanation.

Yes, he did good things. But ISKCON remains, in my mind, nothing but a superficial introduction to the religion. Spook is the closest to any evidence to the contrary that I have come across.