Is it time to talk about guns?

Do you ever read my posts at all?

I never said all guns should be banned and you haven't answered my questions about how mental health services would end gun violence.

1. What do you mean by mental health services?

2. Would anyone be allowed to own a gun even if undergoing mental health services?
If not what type of mental health issues would disqualify you from gun ownership?
Who would determine your mental health?
Would a disqualification for mental health issues be for life, or would there be some kind of review or "cure"?

3. How about those with no known mental health issues until they kill someone?
How would mental health services stop them from being violent?

4. On the inanimate object thing, am I correct in assuming you believe a rock and a gun are very similar when used in a violent act?
If someone were to be found to have mental health issues that would disqualify them from owning a gun would they also not be allowed to own a rock?

5. Or are you saying that if everyone had free mental health services, everyone would be allowed to own any type of gun, knife, or rock they desire?

 

It's very easy to claim my posts are nonsensical when you can't point out how they are nonsensical.

You have made several claims and expressed several opinions, but when questioned about those claims and opinions you can't seem to respond.
The mental services issue is one example. You claim mental health service is the main issue, cause of, and cure for gun violence, but you can't answer any questions concerning mental health.

You admit you can't sell a sawed off shotgun and that "Semi- Automatic weapons are legal to purchase in some, but not all States." (which is not true I believe some form of semi automatic weapon is legal in every state). Then you claim that you don't need a license from the government to own a gun even after you made this statement: "My rights to own a firearm of my choice, (if you, or MeAgain, agree with it) is being infringed--- That word seems to ring a bell--- ."

Didn't you think I'd notice that you went from "a firearm of my choice" (even fully automatic) to "I do not need a license from the Government to own a gun."
A jump from ANY gun to some specific unspecified type of firearm which may not be regulated.

By the way you do know that certain citizens do not have the "right" to own a gun?

 

The National Firearms Act prohibits ownership and sale of all shotguns with a barrel length under 18 inches. Sawed off or not.
To own one with a shorter length requires permits (permission). An example of not being allowed, without special dispensation, the owning of any gun of your choice.

 

I am still waiting for you to point out how my posts are nonsensical and to respond to my questions about mental health services and guns.

Now on to sawed off shotguns, barrels less than 18" overall length less than 26". You claim they are illegal to sale and you claim assault rifles, in contrast to assault weapons, are also illegal.

Sawed off shotguns, or a "short-barreled shotgun" are legal to own at the federal level. But you have to get a permit which includes a federal tax stamp, a class 3 license, registration with the ATF, a background check, fingerprinting, and verification from the local chief law enforcement officer .
To legally make your own, or saw off the barrel yourself, you need a Class 2 manufacturer's license from the ATF. This is only granted to those who can demonstrate a need to make such a weapon and can comply with specific manufacturing guidelines and marking of the weapon. Usually this would be a gun manufacturer.

In addition sawed off shotguns are legal, and can be sold, in Alaska, Arizona, Idaho, Kansas, Kentucky, Louisiana, Maine, Michigan, Mississippi, Missouri, New Mexico, North Carolina, Oklahoma, South Carolina, Texas, and Utah.

Assault rifles, "short, compact, selective-fire weapons that fire a cartridge intermediate in power between submachine gun and rifle cartridges.", are also legal and fall under the Firearm Owners' Protection Act (FOPA) of 1986. I believe they fall under the term machine gun. Owners must undergo the stamp tax, etc.
Connecticut has 52,965 registered machine guns, Nevada has 11,000, Texas has 36,534.
The ATF, according to the 2017 Commencement Report confirmed there were 630,019 machine guns registered nationwide. ~ What to know about machine gun laws in the US

What all this means is that the only right to own a gun that you have is the right granted by the government. You can buy and own certain guns without a license because you are granted that right by the government, and that right did not exist before 2008 unless you were in a recognized governmental militia, such as a state National Guard unit.
There are no "God given" rights to own a gun. The government grants that right and the government can take it away at any time.

Felons, Illegal immigrants, domestic abusers, etc. have not given up their right to own a gun, no one has an a priori right to own a gun...they have not been granted the right to own a gun. There is a difference.
Without a government there are no rights. Only governments can grant rights as without a government we have nothing but chaos and might is the only right.
The common man in the U.S today has been granted the right to own a gun, he has no god given right to a gun and that right can be removed at any time.

 

Not to mention that prior to 2008 government at any level could refuse to allow you to own or have guns of any type anywhere they so desired.

In fact all the 2008 ruling really says is that you can have a gun, in your home, "in defense of hearth and home". Period.
They ruled, by redefining what a militia is, that you have no right to hunt with a gun, transport a gun, protect your business with a gun, target shoot outside of your home, or carry a gun outside of your home unless it is when you are participating in a well regulated governmental militia.

But they negate what a militia is by defining it as:

Which means almost everybody belongs to the ill defined, general, un well regulated "militia".
Of course some of you more astute members may realize that no female in the entire United States and it's territories, etc. are granted any right at all to own any type of gun at all.


Remember women are still second class citizens.

 

And it takes a person to throw a rock. So what is your point?

Are you saying that everyone who shoots someone with a gun is mentally ill?
If so do they become mentally ill as they pull the trigger or prior to pulling the trigger?
If before they pull the trigger how do we identify all of them before they pull that trigger? Should everyone undergo a mental health evaluation?
If they only become mentally ill as they pull the trigger how would mental health services being available prior to them pulling the trigger be of any benefit?

If you aren't saying that everyone who shoots someone with a gun is mentally ill, what are you saying?

Why are you saying I obviously lack the mental ability to have an intelligent discussion?
Obviously to who? You???
Are you some kind of psychiatrist? Do you have a B.S.? Do you have an M.D. or M.O.? Have you completed your residency? Did you pass your USMLE or COMLEX?
Is it obvious becasue I don't agree with your opinions?

But sawed off shotguns are classified by law the same as any shotgun with a barrel under 18". So you are advancing a distinction without a difference as far as the law is concerned.

There is no logical error here.

Let me break it down for you:
You seem to be disagreeing with the premise that there is no "God given" right to own a gun.
Am I correct in assuming that you think the "right" to own a gun is something laying around in the environment or stated in the Bible as something every human ever born is entitled to?
Everyone is born with the right to own a gun just like everyone is born with a brain or a nose? Then the government sometimes takes this right away contrary to natural or "God's" law?
Like they can decide who gets to keep their brain or nose?
Is that what you're saying?
If so we can discuss what rights every new born child is born with in relation to guns.
Do they have a natural in born right to all firearms such as AR15s, Browning Automatic Rifles and Tommy Guns, or just Glocks and Remington Model 870 shotguns?

If you don't think that we are all born with a natural "right" to own a gun, then the government is the one that grants us that right and my argument is as follows:
1. Felons, Illegal immigrants, and domestic abusers are not granted the right to own a gun.
Therefore they can't legally own a gun.

2. The common man in the U.S today (common in that they are not a felon, Illegal immigrant, or domestic abuser) has been granted the right to own a gun.
Therefore they can legally own a gun.

This hinges on the fact that only the government can legally decide whether you may own a gun or not as the government is the entity that writes the laws.
In the first case (number one) a felon, Illegal immigrant, or domestic abuser does not have the right to legally own a gun. It is not granted to them by the law. It may have been granted to them at some time in the past, but as they are now a felon, Illegal immigrant, or domestic abuser they no longer are granted that privilege.

In the second case (number to) as the common man (common in that they are not a felon, Illegal immigrant, or domestic abuser) is granted the right to own a gun as they are not a felon, Illegal immigrant, or domestic abuser who is not granted the privilege of owning a gun.

Please explain the flaw in that logic.

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So is every human who ever lived, and all future humans, born with the right to own guns or does the government grant that right?

Have you even read this far??

 

It takes effort to support your views in an argument or debate.

Unfortunately many people lack the will or desire to question their own views and would rather just skim over other people's opinion's and views.

Intellectual laziness.