Question on Political Stances of Those here

Earthmother

It is nice that you have 50 acres of land you don’t need, to give away for such a venture, sounds interesting.

But I’m not going by what you call yourself or what you claim, I’m going by what you’ve said here and what you’ve said is virtually all right wing. I’ve based my view on the things you say you’d support or wish for, and they all seem based in right wing thinking.

Free market, deregulation, tax cuts, and a weak government are think you seem to support and they’re all things that would make wealth more powerful and influential.

You claim differently but I go on what you say here and you haven’t in any way addressed the criticisms levelled at your views. However you’ve written a lot to evade answering those criticisms but said very little or nothing to refute them.

Even in social areas your thinking seems ultimately based in the social Darwinist idea that people must be self reliant and so you would seem to wish to fade out all government aid or assistance. Again view often expressed by some on the right.

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That for me is the problem, this forum is about debating politics, about presenting ideas and arguments and then seeing if they stand up to scrutiny, answering the critics and deliberating over what’s said.

Most of your posts are promotions of your viewpoint, or praising others who have posting things that fit in with your viewpoint, or telling people that present views that are not compatible with your viewpoint that they’re wrong with little or no real explanation as to why.

Yes that’s talking but it’s not political debate.

I have nothing against people presenting their ideas here but I do get annoyed with those that seem completely unwilling to actually debate those views, who evade address critics and seem unwilling or unable to defend ideas that they are very happy to promote.

I’ll ask you again can you drop the melodramatics, stop the evasion and address all the things that remain outstanding.

 

Drew

Not Greece, since there was no Greek state t that time, there were city states, there were a few democracies in Greece around that time but most people associate it most with Athens.

And Athenian democracy was limited

wiki

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Shadow

A republic can be a democracy, a democracy can be a republic, they are not mutually exclusive.

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Where did I say I was giving it away?

No, If I went back and tried to figure out all the "outstanding" questions you have asked me that I have not answered to your satisfaction it would take a year.

But, if you would like to HIRE me to spend all my time figuring out all the worlds ills and what to do about them, when do I start and how much are ya gonna pay me?

 

earthmother

Quote:
It is nice that you have 50 acres of land you don’t need, to give away for such a venture, sounds interesting.

Fine so you’re saying it’s still your property, you own it, you still have the ultimate control of it, people can use it that way because you are allowing them for the time being to use it that way, but you retain the right to change your mind if that is your wish?

Is that it?

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Quote:
I’ll ask you again can you drop the melodramatics, stop the evasion and address all the things that remain outstanding.

How about the same amount I get for moderating these forums?

Thing is that this is just another evasion, I haven’t asked you that much, most of it has been very similar questions or inquires that wouldn’t be that difficult to reply to if you just answered them. In fact you’ve spent a lot more words, time and effort evading replying to them than it would have to just come out and answered openly and honestly.

 

I already knew this.

What is your point?

Or, are you just evading?!?


Also, let's call a spade a spade.

Democracy hasn't existed since before Christ.

 

Whatever (yawn)

 

Earthmother

This seems indicative of your attitude.

I’m still not clear what your political stance is because you don’t seem willing or able to explain away the apparent contradiction between what you claim and what you say you support and promote.

The thing about you giving this 50 acres you had spare over to this project was that, if it isn’t theirs its yours, its under your rule, they can do what they want there but what if they squatted it and claim it as theirs, would you allow that?

You claim to have ceded this land from US government control but have you ceded it from your control?

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Drew

Since Christ? Jesus Christ? Around the time of the Roman emperors Augustus and Tiberius, time of the Han Dynasty in China, the Parthian emperors in the Middle East etc.

Was Jesus elected?

So where were these major democracies your talking about?

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Your comprehension skills seem to be lacking.


If you go back and look at the post you quoted in your last post, you will see that I said since before christ.


How can you expect to moderate effectively if you can't even read correctly?



P.S. You're evading again!

 

actually they are two very different forms of government. because u made such an ignorant post it is clear u dont know what ur talking about. go look it up before you reply to this.

america is a republic. unfortunately it has been transformed into a false democracy.

 

It isn't ignorance, its doublespeak!

 

no drew in this case im pretty sure its ignorance. i even said to look up the difference to anyone who cares. if he didnt care he shouldnt have reposted but he did.

 

No, I'm pretty sure he has an agenda.


By blurring the lines between the words they confuse the people, until they wake up under a fascist government.

 

I think we should work hard at ignoring him...

 

thats government agenda in general. i guess he doesnt realize that big government was what occured in world war 2 germany, italy, japan, post WW2 Russia, and other nations. notice a trend here? none of them treated their people well and none of them lasted too long. (with the exception of North Korea as it is obviously still in power after only 50 years of existance)

 

drew


OK so before Christ, which democracy are you talking about?

We’ve covered the Athenian one, which was not a full democracy it was a limited democracy as were the others in the rest of the Hellenistic world. As to the democratic elements within the Roman Republic they again were limited on property grounds.

So what are you trying to point to?

 

Shadow

Republic

Random House Dictionary

Collins Essential English Dictionary

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Democracy

Random House Dictionary

Collins Essential English Dictionary

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Oh those poor ignorant people at Random House and Collins.

Oh it is possible to quibble if you define democracy in the most narrowly viewed way possible rather than the more widely seen way as defined by Random House and most others. And by seeing things only in that narrow way people could call everyone else ignorant but…

Anyway I wonder why someone would want to really emphasis the idea of republic over any democratic element, in fact trying to play down the democratic elements so it seems less important.

You see a republic can be a democracy (as seen by Random House) but it doesn’t have to be (note the ‘citizens entitled to vote’)

It would be possible to take the vote away from very large numbers of people and remain a Republic, while doing so would make people question if you were actually a democracy (as defined by random House et al).

The modern definition of democracy is of the wide spread enfranchisement of the citizenry.

But the US republic began with very limited voting rights (only white male property owners) and it was still a republic. Voting rights were fought for often in the face of opposition from established powers and it could be argued that the US didn’t really become a modern democracy until 1965 with the Voting Rights Act.

Now if those voting rights were taken away and again only white male property owners were allowed to vote the US would still be a republic.

Now being someone that likes democracy I would look to it as the best element within a society, but maybe someone that wasn’t so keen on democracy would prefer to emphasis and define the republican element.

For example there has been disquiet over the number of criminals been disenfranchised (many poor and black) with people saying this isn’t a good trend in a democracy, but those in favour of such policies could just reply that the US is a Republic where it is possible to limit who can vote.

Now since this could be an interesting debate but isn’t really the subject of this thread I’m going to begin a thread for it on its own. Please reply there.

 

Shadow if you wish to discuss the republic/democracy issue please do so in the new thread not this one.

I will cut and paste your post into the new thread then delete it from here

 

which new thread is that balbus?

EDIT dont respond to this. i found it.

 

My point is that democracy hasn't existed since before Christ!



I already said that....

 

nor is it supposed to exist in america.