Religion.

I apologize stinkfoot, I realize that I am not the best writer and in fact I have no formal education on the art itself, I only know my ABC's and how to speak with a clear focal presentation
Maybe just try reading the last 2-3 sentences? That about sum's it all up from my position I believe. It's just Love, and there is so much of it for all of us to share with each other!

 

Religion, and most of science is nothing more than a heap of unfounded beliefs. At least science will comprimise a bit with the term "theory", as it's nothing more than that. No one who partakes in any sort of thought or belief of evolution or something based in a religion has no place to call out anyone else on what they believe. At all.

Even athiests, who don't believe in any of it can't truly know if they're right or wrong.

Hell, Pastafarians make just as much sense as any one else. ( http://www.venganza.org/ )

Its not even about what you believe in, it should be what that belief makes of you as a person. If believing in a giant flying spaghetti monster makes you do good deeds and treat people sensibly, so be it. Personal beliefs should be no reason to fight. One wouldn't want another to push their thoughts onto them, so why do it?

 

Only meatballs worship giant flying spaghetti monsters. To require belief in something outside oneself in order to do good deeds doesn't speak very highly of one's character.

Religion is little more than organized superstition from my perspective. Believe in something outside if that helps you but first, believe in yourself.

 

Not exactly, you closed minded twat. You obviously aren't very learned in a whole lot. FSM is simply proof that you can take anything and make something out of it. Whether it be a man named Jesus, or a big ball of pasta.

Way to completely misunderstand my other post. You truly are an idiot. I won't retype it, but if you re-read it and don't understand, try asking your mother or something.

Organized superstition, eh? Can you disprove religion? What makes you think that one of them aren't right? Who's to say? You're comfortable in your beliefs and that works for you. Great.

 

I'll re-read the post and you re-read the vial that you took your medication from. You might have messed up the dosage.

I in no way promote my thoughts on religion as fact. They are opinion. Fortunately I can permit you to creatively interpret my arguments. However, I cannot be quite so charitable about personal attacks. There is an element of entertainment regarding extremely angry sounding posting. However calling people idiots crosses the line and calling a moderator an idiot has a way of reflecting the observation back to you. I invite you to revisit your style of debate.

Peace.

Nope... not funny. This was uncalled for. Mea culpa

 

jesus fucking christ... this thread is a load of crap

i mean... carry on

[i didnt expect this sort of thread in 'Marijuana']

 

dude your really lame. Metallideth freaking pwned you so get off your high stool and go back to watching bill orielly and playing your guitar hero old fart. Your "debating" style is pretty shitty to say the least.

 

Oh. You're a moderator. Thats neat. But it doesn't inherently make your posting worth anything more than anyone else's. I'll call it like I see it, deal with that.

By the way, oh holy moderator, you did take it upon yourself to personally attack me before I even spoke to you, so it's funny that you'd bring that up against my response.

Of course the whole religion belief deal is your opinion, there really can't be an argument of facts, as if one thing is a fact, a contradicting statement can't also be fact.

I don't intend on sounding angry, if that is your characterization of my post, very well.

"To require belief in something outside oneself in order to do good deeds doesn't speak very highly of one's character."

You don't seem to realize that it is what influences you (such as religion, or any belief) that creates one's character, if you were left without influence, what character would you have? If believing in a lump of pasta makes you a decent person, who has the right to tell you that you and your beliefs are crazy?

 

WTF are you on about?

Stinkfoot clearly misunderstood what the church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster is about... as it is hard to realise what it is upon 5 minutes spent on that site.

Because of this Metallideth started insulting him.
Stinkfoot replied in a polite manner.. which shows that his debating style is far superior to 'Fuck of you stupid twat blah blah death metal RAWR'.

To Stinkfoot: The church of the flying spaghetti monster is a mock religion created by athiests/agnostics in reply to the school system letting christianity be taught in sicnece lessons because there is as much proof for it as there is for science..

 

Its not hard to realize what it is at all. Comprehension is key to understanding, if you lack that, you're missing out on a lot.

Sarcasm is a good way to insult someone, so I guess the insults started before I started throwing them.

Since when do people debate over debating styles? How rediculous.

Gotta love your need to stereotype, certainly signs of a small mind.

"blah blah, death metal, rawr" Definitely what I said.

By the way, wipe your lips man, you've got that dude's shit smeared all across them.

 

I didn't start the debate of 'debating styles' the guy with his cock up your ass did.

And judging by the hatemail on venganza.com not many people realise that it's a joke.... even some atheists think that they really worship a spaghetti monster.

It's not obvious for a reason.. it's a mock religion and you have to actualy read deeper to realise that.

Just because someone made a mistake you call them a close minded twat?

Fuck yehhhhh METAL

</childish insults>
</conversation>

 

I didn't ask who started the debate, you took part in it, yes? Lame.

There truly are a lot of idiots in the world, as shown by the hate mail on venganza and by a few of my conversationalist counterparts.

Because someone made a mistake by acting on incorrect information to make judgements against people giving one's self the image of being closed minded toward their supposed beliefs, I will call it how I see it.

 

so, did anyone else bother to read Relayer's post? Because it was very insightful, and though it may require a re-read or two to fully understand what he is saying, it is one of the most intelligent/philosophical posts I have ever read on hipforums.

I don't agree with all of the conclusions and I certainly can't say I hold the same beliefs, but it was a good summary of a lot of my own realizations that I've come to in my search for spirituality. Like the idea that "God" (if there is a God) would be a lot more than merely the physical being seen in (most) religions.

My parents purposefully didn't subscribe me and my brothers to any religion so that we could find our own spirituality. I began my own investigation by looking at the religions of people I knew, and the beliefs seemed so contrived and simple. It is also easy to see the links between the motives of the more ancient religions, which have been dismissed in the modern world, and the religions of today, being that both were created to explain the unknowns in the world and give meaning to people's lives. Thus I became an atheist.

Then mescaline reopened my eyes to spirituality at the age of 15. This lead me to the idea that drugs, particularly psychedelic ones, could guide me to my own spirituality. I saw the world as fantastic and awe inspiring. Yet two years later I am still not sure of anything. In my current beliefs I am viscously opposed to almost every form of religion and have argued (mainly against Christianity) on forums all over the web. I see now that this was pointless and silly. I believe that nature and natural settings are the closest we can come to understanding our world. I also harbor many cynical and negative beliefs regarding humanity in general.(I was interupted and lost my train of thought, but I'll just abort post)

 

Revisiting this to see exactly where I spun the debate out of control....

This was a lame pun on my part-- spaghetti and meatballs- get it? This was in no way intended to characterize you as such. I don't know you well enough to make that judgment and if I thought so I'd have the decorum to keep it to myself. Please accept my sincerest apologies if this was read in any other way.

This is a personal opinion and nothing more

This could have been worded better although it reflects how I've seen how many people manipulate others via their belief system. I was brought up in a Pentecostal church and a good amount of what was taught has proven itself to be unadulterated bullshit and has tended to jade my view of religion in general. The fact that this constitutes prejudice is not lost on me however.

After reading what I wrote, I might have been well advised to weigh what I contributed because I'm keenly aware that debates about religion have a way of striking a nerve and if I'm going to be careless with what I write I need to accept that there will be repercussions. I'll revisit your post and give it the thoughtful response it is due...

Admission of the possibility of not having all the answers will lend credibility to one who is delivering data if not the data itself. It suggests that a mind is open to other thinking. I tend to agree with this.

This may not stop some though..

I wouldn't mind sitting in on their communion, if they have one!

I would differ with this a little- not completely though. There needs to be strength of character to begin with or an individual will rationalize and "cherry pick" scripture to serve their own purposes. The complication to the last part is because some folks' beliefs compel them to spread their belief system as the one true path- the implication being that other faiths are paths to destruction.

 

Naw... I kind put myself in that situation by not giving Metallideth's post the read it needed before bothering to reply. He reacted because I clearly took a small portion of what he wrote out of context. I'll have to learn guitar before I'll ever play it and watching Bill O'Reilly gives me the hives. I'm in the process of correcting the bumps that the half-awake portion of me that was posting created.

 

I think everything you just said was amazing, but THIS is one of the happiest thoughts I've read lately

 

Thanks but it wasn't me misunderstanding, it was me not bothering to read it through and trying to be clever. The man posted a decent contribution and rightly expected that responders would at very least give it the thorough read it deserved. It was as much a flip response I wrote under the illusion that it was witty that ignited this whole war of words.

I have to confess that I did assume that the church of the flying spaghetti monster was an invention of Metallideth and read that as a license to respond with half baked wit.

 

Thank you polecat for your kynd words!
It is surely the most difficult path to take in life, not to love God, but to live for God amongst people who feel the need to break you apart in order to build themselves up. But it is the people who stay strong, like a candle flame that never bends to any winds, who experience the amazing transcendence of the ego into the soul. To tap the source of eternal Bliss is something that not only do people have no idea how to even look for, but people are generally not ready to handle it. There is a typcially subtle energy that we all use (most without even realizing it) but this same energy will fry your mind if it is used improperly. It's all about a life of balance, compassion, and understanding, acceptance of the fact that the temporary human mind we are stuck to will never truly know anything about everything. But the soul, it already and always has known everything, becuase it IS everything. You, me, the people on this forum, the people of the Earth, the muultiverse and the entire vibrational existance of matter are just pale reflections of something much greater, and behind the scences, the Life and Intellilgence that guides the harmonic universe, is what we truly are. We are all the same, at the core of our consciousness, and it is through seeing the same Love in your neighbor as you do in yourself that the peace of mind and will power to persevere will come to you.
It's ok to be confused, most of my magic mushroom trips are so overwhelmingly profound and confusing that I destroy and concept of existance I had with every trip. But it is this breaking away process that brings us closer to Home.
Peace, love, good health and a great weekend to all of my family.
namaste children! -

 

I feel like maybe, just maybe....God watches us in our infinitely schizophrenic search for meaning, and laughs heartily.

 

1- In my estimation, this pretty well explains why I find organized religions to be inherently self-limiting.
2- Yes but it's an individual's life experience is going to color how they react to another's professed faith or lack thereof. Understanding where one is coming from is key to being able to reach them in my opinion. (yeah I know, thank you captain obvious!)
3- The last part of this better describes my rather imprecise characterization of organized religion as harnessed superstition. Whether it's an honest misunderstanding of an omniscient deity or a calculated misappropriation of peoples' faith, the manner in which many sects promote themselves assaults their very credibility in my mind. A faith that reflects one's own quest for answers and wisdom is the truest path for that one individual but should never be promoted as a one size fits all trip to enlightenment... partly because enlightenment itself is a journey and not a destination... my opinion, of course.
4- Ability must run concurrent with willingness. Sometimes the intangibility of a message causes the mind to close. One problem I've seen with many religious messages is that not only do they not make sense but they talk down to the audience. I think the Christian metaphor of church leaders being shepherds is quite apt as one needs to be an unthinking sheep to follow. Further, and on the lines of willingness is the fact that people will believe what they're ready to believe. We will see chaos if that is what we want to see and if we are open to intelligent construct, we will see that as well. Is it not the most clever of mindful feats of engineering that can pass itself off as chaos? Akin to the most genius of comics that can convincingly play the fool.
5- You are a credit to your beliefs and although I may not share them 100% I respect the manner in which you chose to express them. Like an extra large pizza I had to digest the post piece by piece and put thought into my response. This is clearly a meatier thread than I had assumed and must express my appreciation to Metallideth for delivering a measured wake-up call that inspired me to revisit the contributions that I had not given the justice of a thorough read. I've always respected you, John (Relayer) and forcing myself to digest what you have put so much thoughtful energy into only deepens that respect. Much peace to you, brother.