Scouts

Ok Osiris From reading your other post now I understand you better also. I can relate in multiple ways. I have experienced the hardship of someone close to me being hospitalized against their will for their own good. The pain of watching someone take medication. The struggle of thinking someone can overcome a mental illness or accept love when they can't etc...ugh. And I have been through my own divorce. Luckily not as messy one as some but still. Hang in there and good luck!!

 

It is obvious you think something is full of shit, but you don't know me, period.

You defend your "philosophical" argument by characterizing me as unworthy of offering meaningful observations. I give examples of a vital life to inform you that you are misinterpreting where I come from. At this egotistical level, it is expected that you would find those most agreeable whom agree with you.

What exactly are you, purely?
There is no good or bad in the phenomenal world. Good and bad are the arbitrary use of our powers of distinction, the ability to tell one thing from another. All things are lawful, but not all things are helpful. Helpful is a matter of timing. What is helpful, good by your estimation, may not be helpful in another instance.

The problem with your perspective on good and evil is that you give yourself absolute authority to make that distinction with woefully limited information.
It makes you appear a bigot. I can say this from the experience of listening you characterize my life and words.

Obviously, you would dictate morality and the parameters of "moral action" to the world.

The only thing you will suffer from this conversation is how you appear to others.

 

I mean she is equal to your regard in every sense.

My point is that regardless her difficulties she remains a powerful teacher to you.

The well have no need of a physician. Some have limited physio/mental capacity to engage in life independently and those may remind us that we are after all interdependent.
For those who apparently can operate independently, there are seeming choices to be made. All of them are informed not so much by what is out there, as from our conceptual regard of the world. Everything experiential to the individual arises from, conception. It is true of our biological form as it is true of our interior mental landscape.

The thing that makes mans inhumanity to man possible is that the other is not or none of me or mine. We have a native impulse to protect what belongs vitally to ourselves.

Our preferential differences are not differences in humanity but serve to invite the experiences that we prefer. We gravitate toward the things we like and are repulsed by things we dislike.

 

Sounds a lot like, perception is not knowledge, (not strictly true), but can lead to it, (it is the only basis for knowledge we have to go on.)

I agree your mind is a kingdom you alone can rule and that includes making yourself subservient to one impulse or another. There are no victims, there are phenomena and how we react to them. How you react to any phenomena arises naturally from your conceptions/perceptions of what phenomena represent in your model of a good world.

The most appropriate reaction in all instances is had from the clearest perception of truly existential matters, just as you have said.

I add to what you have observed to state that the perception of good and bad is a particularly poor way to apprehend phenomena. Those perceptions are wholly subjective, and most often not even personally chosen but cultured by societal norms. Culture is, of the cult.

 

Bullshit!! It's been a long day. Put that pill away, and somebody get these boys some coffee . . . stat!

 

Greetings earth man.

 

Would it kill you to capitalize the E? A little respect? Huh?

But yes, greetings to you as well.

 

Sorry for being less than, punctual?

 

yep

 

Shrug.

 

To reiterate in different terms: it seems to me that throughout history certain individuals have pushed the boundaries of or (secretly or openly) defied social convention and moral tradition. As anyone should logically suspect, these individuals must either enter into adverse circumstances or prepare for the possibility that going against the grain will have adverse consequences. They must have strong wills and resolve to see through their course. They may fail and never be known even if they do. The knowing of them isn't important anyway. What is important is the knowing of what their efforts did or did not accomplish, and what this can tell those who come after about how to proceed.

I see that the primary issue with people comrehending my first attempt is my tendency to lapse into poetic language and purple prose. Sorry. Writer and long time reader of pulp fiction here! Campy, campy, campy...

 

thedope, if you edit the comma out of your last post, all is forgiven.

And for the record, you weren't "less than punctual" as much as you "lacked punctuation."

Come to think of it, appropriate capitalization is not a matter of punctuation at all.

 

The comma is a drama mamma. I use the popular or astronomical spelling of the word earth. The capitalized form of the word is formal. I would be less than punctual by not appearing formal at the appropriate time, helpful being a matter of appropriate time in space.

As to the matter of respect, would I love you suffice?

What do you think? Do I have any hope of penetrating the scab that has formed over this ego? I think I might have been too much the prick in pricking it.

I really think that the idea that someone has a special handle on suffering is suffering a kind of delusion. Specialness is an ego device. The ego, (small e thinking it should be capitalized), identifies and perpetuates itself on apparent differences. To such an ego, If you have no special attributes, or special information, then you have no significance as an individual and the idea of self worth is a constant issue.

My worth immediately becomes an issue with osiris because I don't carry their torch for them.

Osiris, growth occurs at the edges. We gain agility by leaving our comfort zone. So flipping what? It is the same for every one. Your suffering will never make my suffering less. If you choose to suffer less then less suffering will be apparent to you.

I see your smiley face and shrug in response to me, doesn't matter, I will continue to address the issues you raise as you raise them. This is not the first time I've been ignored. It really does seem you who doesn't measure up to the your claim of being able to stand up to the heat.
Regardless, I feel you have relevant things to say in regards to our common humanity if you were to recognize it exists.

 

I would be interested in hearing osiris's definition of evil.

 

Twenty years ago I read a book that explained to me in as simple terms as possible that this that I call reality is what it is despite my ego's attempt to assign unreal meaning and motive to everything and everyone within it. To add insult to injury, the meaning and the motive that my ego assigns to every thing and every one is based on the meaning and motives that other egos have assigned to every thing and every one. I'm just beginning to see that the purpose of me calling something or someone bad is to allow my ego to vent its rage at the new enemy it has found because if I don't call it bad, I don't know what to think or do about it. It does seem to be a dilemma.

 

A good response to what we see is so. As in, it is so. As it is so, so what?

We cultivate a self image, (ego), for our self and we cultivate one for each and everyone around us to the extent we think we are familiar with them.
We also in the same way egotistically classify groups of egos as we and them.

Well, you could reserve judgment. A phenomena does not need my yes or no to be phenomenal. What you see as bad is not the phenomena but the way you apprehend it and in conjunction your attitude toward it. A rule of thumb that has seemed to give me a full hand-le on the real appearance of things is, anxiety is caused by the misapprehension of what is so. Reality supports real things and is not in contention with itself. The contention is caused by what is believed to be, not what is so. I count my anxiety as a sign that I have not understood and that I am entertaining some mistaken belief about what I see.

 

As would I.

 

Ok, let's use the example in osiris's post in which a person molests or rapes a child. The common response is to call that person a monster and demand that they be punished; preferably in a prison cell where they themselves will be molested or raped.

When I was a kid, and one of my siblings would make another sibling cry, their tears and pain seemed to magically dissolve and be replaced with a look of joyful satisfaction the moment my mother laid hands on the aggressor. God I'd like to think we've moved on from that kind of . . . simple-minded sense of justice, but sometimes the call for satisfaction is so blinding that punishing the perpetrator is thought to be essential to getting closure.

 

I agree, which is why I am not in favor of the death penalty.