The Big Bang is Bunk.

Discussion in 'Science and Technology' started by dd3stp233, Jan 21, 2006.

  1. EllisDTripp

    EllisDTripp Green Secessionist

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    And a Google on his name turns up an endless array of woo-woo sites, and precious little science...:(
     
  2. paintingjames

    paintingjames freaky fish

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    if you limit yourself to only what Google has to offer, to learn potentially pearl of wisdom, you may have to search harder than the stockyard of the swine

    where does "ground charge"come from, you ask El...well...don't you know the ground is charged?

    Does Lightning Travel Up? Or Down?

    [size=-1]December 5, 2002

    By Steve Pool
    [/size]


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    SEATTLE - It travels in both directions, really. In a cloud-to-ground strike, an electric charge from the cloud starts coming down, and gets about 2/3 the way toward the ground.

    At that point, a return stroke of opposite charge will race up from the ground and meet the original charge, creating a channel where the electricity can flow back and forth several times until the charges have been neutralized. So the short answer is that the lightning collides in mid-air between the cloud and ground.
     
  3. EllisDTripp

    EllisDTripp Green Secessionist

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    Uh,...no.

    Electrical charge is a RELATIVE thing. An object can only be said to be "charged" when its potential is measured in reference to something else. And in most cases, that "something else" is the earth itself.

    The earth is generally considered as a universal zero voltage reference point, hence the "ground rods" driven in at electrical installations, and the use of underground water piping and the like to provide a "ground connection" for your home's electrical service panel.

    The ground is only "charged" if you ignore standard engineering practice and convention, and measure potential with reference to something isolated from ground, like maybe the clouds? But then you would be saying that the ground is charged, while the clouds are...grounded.
     
  4. paintingjames

    paintingjames freaky fish

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    Eh you're right, it's not coming from the ground...

    Chapter 1 The[size=+1] Early Years[/size]



    [p. 20] "I started my experiments with the taking of electricity from the ground, as I termed it, during the summer of 1909. By fall of 1910 I had sufficient power to operate a small electrical device, and I made a demonstration of my idea to two friends... This demonstration in the early stages consisted of operating a miniature arc light... It soon became evident that the energy was not static and that the static of the universe would be of no assistance to me in obtaining the power I was seeking...

    During the Christmas Holidays of 1911, I began to fully realize that the energy I was working with was not of a static nature, but of an oscillating nature. Further I realized that the energy was not coming out of the earth, but instead was coming to the earth from some outside source. These electrical oscillations in the form of waves were not simple oscillations, but were surgings --- like the waves of the sea --- coming to the earth continually, more in the daytime than at night, but always coming in vibrations from the reservoir of colossal energy out there in space. By this time I was able to obtain enough power to light the old 16-candlepower carbon lamp for about one half capacity, and I did not seem to make any further improvement until the spring of 1925."

    [p. 21] In 1912 he was called to go on a mission for the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, and under a visitor's visa was allowed to enter Sweden during the Exhibition of 1912 in Stockholm...

    In his notebook, dated November 1, 1913, Henry included a memo that he had obtained material from a railroad car at Abisco, Sweden the previous summer, and material from the side of a hill. He made electric tests of these materials, taking them home to try each as a detector for his energy machine. Tests indicated that this soft, white stone-like substance might make a good "valve-like detector"*.

    [ * This "valve-like detector" is what led Henry to do research in semi-conductive materials, and from this soft white stone he developed his first Moray valve and the Moray valve that was used in some of the early Radiant Energy devices] [p. 22] "Silver wire used on stone makes a rectifier."

    http://www.rexresearch.com/moray2/morayrer.htm

    Chapter 2

    Radiant Energy In Earnest

    [p. 31] Henry Moray demonstrated that energy was available by its actions on a resistive load, such as a flat-iron or a space heater, and by lighting lights. A resistive load is directly proportional to the amount of energy delivered to it. In heating a heater or lighting a light, the number of watts produced can be calculated as equal to the number of watts consumed. This energy is fed into a load to give either heat/light, or power. A motor can be operated but must be designed for high frequency. The Radiant Energy device operation is shown in Figure 54, in which he used an antenna and a ground connected to his solid state RE device...

    He was able to show that none of the energy came from within his device. Internally the device was electrically dead when it had not been connected and tuned to the antenna. When his device was set up, he could connect it to an antenna and ground, and by priming it first and then tuning it as he primed it, the device would draw electrical energy. This high frequency electrical energy produced up to 250,000 volts and it lighted a brighter light than witnesses had ever before seen. Heavy loads could be connected to the device without dimming the lights that were already connected to it. This device worked many miles from any known source of electrical energy. Such as transmission lines or radio. The device produced up to 50,000 watts of power and worked for long periods of time....

    He assumed at first that this energy was electromagnetic in origin; however, he never claimed that it was electromagnetic in nature. He assumed at first that this energy came from the earth. But later he believed it was from the universe. Finally he began to believe that it was present throughout all space, intermolecular space as well as terrestrial and celestial space. He did not necessarily understand how his detectors operated, only that if he very carefully built the device according to his calculations, it worked. He was able to demonstrate the existence of an energy that today, though it has not been identified or proven, has been theorized by many researchers...

    [p. 32] As early as 1904, Nicola Tesla, experimenting with AC currents of high potential and high frequency, said: "Ere many generations pass, our machinery will be driven by a power obtainable at any point in the universe... Throughout space there is energy. Is this energy static or kinetic? If static, our hopes are in vain; if kinetic --- and this we know it is for certain --- then it is a mere question of time when men will succeed in attaching their machinery to the very wheelwork of nature."
     
  5. fat_tony

    fat_tony Member

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    It doesnt sound electromagnetic in nature. I havent given it a lot of thought and if im completely honest im probably never will, but as im doing diode equivalent circuits at this very moment i thought id at least read it. Unfortunately the introduction gave me a headache. Im not sure where to start because no source of energy. The fundamental component of electromagnetism is charge and all the effects we know come in some way from manipulating it. I cant help but notice that there is, well no mention of any charge, so im guessing it violates the first Maxwell equation and presumably the other 3. Not to mention common sense.

    Though if anyone knows of who has theorized this energy I would gladly read it, but im going to be honest im sceptical.
     
  6. EllisDTripp

    EllisDTripp Green Secessionist

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    Any long, isolated conductor (antenna) at high elevations will pick up a static charge due to the friction of air molecules blowing across it. This effect is particularly pronounced under low humidity conditions.

    This sounds like a much more reasonable explanation than tapping into some mysterious "free energy" source that hasn't been observed or confirmed ever since...
     
  7. shaggie

    shaggie Senior Member

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  8. shaggie

    shaggie Senior Member

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    I've heard that Moray tried to patent his germanium rectifier and that it was rejected because it didn't have a cathode heater. :) Not sure if that's true.

    .
     
  9. bamboo

    bamboo Hip Forums Supporter HipForums Supporter

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    Some one a bit back said that the earth has zero charge and electrical engineers utilize that, however if one does a little research it will become apparent that there can be a voltage difference of as much as several thousand volts between seperate ground rods however, and this is important, there is little or now current available. Also there is a corresponding atmospheric charge that raises by a few volts every so many feet starting as close to the ground as about 6 feet and rising the higher one goes. the earth is awash in electrical and magntic forces partly form itself and the constant stream of charged particle streaming past us from the sun. I think Morays device just flooded the antenna with charge above a certain point and the "valve or gate" stopped the flow until the charge level had dropped below a critical level. The system may have included enough capacitance to make the whole thing semi-stable. It is important that before it would work it had to be "tuned"...I agree with the guy above that it sounded a lot like a very large crystal radio set up.
     
  10. EllisDTripp

    EllisDTripp Green Secessionist

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    Of course, the concept of "ground" is a local thing, and there can be a difference in potential between 2 ground rods. This is why all the ground rods serving a structure must be bonded together.

    But in order to have a potential difference of several kV between 2 ground rods, either the 2 rods are on opposite sides of the earth, and/or you have a hell of a lot of current flowing through the earth (which is a relatively good conductor). Older utility setups used to use the earth as a return conductor in order to save wire, but the practice was stopped when it was discovered that livestock (particularly dairy cows) were very sensitive to the "step potential" developed between their hooves as they stood under powerlines.
     
  11. bamboo

    bamboo Hip Forums Supporter HipForums Supporter

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    The ground can be a good conductor or it can be a good insulator depending on compostion, moisture content and voltage / current flow. A lot of what tesla did with planar waves relied on the ground being an insulator and the charge being contained between the earth and the higher charged porion of the atmosphere. Bottom line is that there are a lot of energy potentials and possibilities that we simply do not look at on a day to day basis...possibilities that need to be explored. heck there is a guy in hawaii that says you can do some pretty amazing things by bringing up deep ocean cold water and using the difference in temperature of the cold water and normal air temps. to generate electricty, improve crop growth, have an unlimited air conditioning source etc.
     
  12. paintingjames

    paintingjames freaky fish

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    yo EL yer wrong, it is Kinetic energy emanating through all things. It is the true harnessing of the lightning. Sorry to burst yer shiney lil wire bubble. To think Tesla was some meager optimist...damnit man when will you realize how much things could change if people like you could be convinced of limits beyond your wildest dreams Exist if you could conceive of un-preconceived notions that set men on the "fringe"

    OK, so how do you explain such phenomenom as the Brown Mtn. Lights of North Carolina, which have been simulated in a labrotory controlled by the physical makeup of the mountain itsellf...composed of layers of quartz and magnetite.
    It is the most amazing thing to witness, these orbs of light flocking down the mountainside have been known everything as civil war spirits to 'Indian' warriors. If they happen to float right up to you, it will "dance" around your energy feild. If you walk towards it it will stay exactly the same distance away, and if you go the other way so too will "It" follow. In other words if potential energy which people are now...reach out to touch kinetic energy, you'll get zapped good. The two can only be combine with reverence. Yin and Yang fire on the mountainside. It's true, go camping there one time since it's on national forest land and see and experience for yourself. PM me for directions.

    This newly understood phenom is called "ball lightning" and debunks the spirit myths of the previous generation. And proves the myths of people like Tesla and Moray's genius. The earth is a huge conductor, the core being solid Iron. It is attracting all kinds of cosmic attention. Just look at the magnetic field it produces in a supposed "devoid" vacuum. It's not just solar winds reaching the shores of the earth, yet everything in the cosmos. Why would it be any other way?


    Yes! We are saturated with energy! Fuciking emmersed in the Ether man, yet are persuaded as Henry Ford was when he introduced his hemp oiled automobile to trust PETRO and even claim it the AMerican nation's number 1 threat to national security if twas to run out of it.
    Hmm...yeah, coincidence
     
  13. fat_tony

    fat_tony Member

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    Kinetic energy, electrical energy, zero point energy how many different kinds of energy can we pin this on, if we can squeeze gravitational in its almost a clean sweep. Three completely different kinds of energy with completely different origins. It takes a huge static charge to cause a bolt of lightning whether its friction between different air masses or artificial structures and the air. I think theres even some potential in the thermocline layer in the oceans but i have no idea how that works. The Moray stuff didnt give much experimental details but it didnt mention moving mountains or air masses.

    I dont know much about this phenomenon in North Carolina but the correlation between the traffic density and the density of sightings was amusing. Also the fact that there were no confirmed sightings until after the road was built. Though clearly there is some legend dating back a few centuries. This reminds me of that episode of the Simpsons where Lisa finds that angel skeleton and it turns out to be a marketing campaign, people see what they want to see, if they didnt magicians would be out of business very quickly. Also as its so close to a major road why has no one set up a decent quality camera watching the site? More to the point why are the few picks I found so ludicrously low quality even if you werent expecting it and only had a phone or little disposable one the quality would be better.
     
  14. paintingjames

    paintingjames freaky fish

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    LIGHT

    Brown Mountain Lights

    Burke County, North Carolina
    DIRECTIONS: In North Carolina, drive on Highway 181 west of Morganton about twelve miles through the Pisgah National Forest to the overlook at milepost 20.
    Look low, towards the valley of boulders before Brown Mountain: the lights begin in the trees here, as great basketballs of fire. Flaring and creeping along the long, low mountain ridge, they appear pale pink on occasion, or halogen yellow, or sometimes a brilliant, blinding blue-white. Look quickly: they flit in and out of the trees and shoot up horizontally into the sky in a matter of seconds, disappearing into the night sky, their trails a dull match-tip red.

    According to an account in the Charlotte Observer in 1913: “Many have scoffed at this ‘spooky’ thing, and those members of the Morganton Fishing Club who first saw it more than two years ago were laughed at and accused of ‘seeing things at night’ as a result of a common human frailty.” In 1962, the Observer reported that a witness to the lights was struck with an overwhelming sensation of dizziness as the ball of light appeared to approach him. It made a sizzling sound, he said.

    Hey fat tony glad you trust a few random web sites you just looked up rather than Cherokee and Catawba stories of this revered sacred mountain of fire dating back to 1200 a.d. and earlier. Do sum research!
     
  15. fat_tony

    fat_tony Member

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    If I believed every ancient story id be a Christian, Muslim, Jewish Monotheist. Whilst violently believing in Polytheism. Id simulataneously be a Pantheist and not. Id believe in Robin Hood and King Arthur. Id have voodoo and other supersticious paraphenalia lined up along window, not to mention the garlic to protect me against Dracula. The story of Noahs Ark would both be a flood on the Euphrates and world wide flood of epic proportions. But above all id be a raving schizophrenic (thats clearly spelt wrong). So to protect my delicate mental state im careful what I believe in. Of course theres some truth behind every legend, but also a fair bit of myth, there have been many sightings of vampires over the years, yet theres no garlic round my neck tonight, you?
     
  16. paintingjames

    paintingjames freaky fish

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    trancend the bounds of mental slavery my friends, realize the Earth is tied in with this transition. the sings are always present are you there to realize them? understand some storeis are so insane they have to be true, if you only knew a thing or two.
     
  17. Make Mangoes Not War

    Make Mangoes Not War Member

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    I don't believe in the Big Bang Theory but its a helluva lot more believable that the "Steady State Theory". Screw you Steady State Theory!
     
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