The Communists are getting power.. again.. Oh GOD!

This is ridiculous. You communists want everyone else to do your own work for you. I don't care how much you think it won't help for you to give away your earnings, it has to start somewhere, right? So stop being greedy hypocrites, and donate ALL of your earnings away. Throw your property away to, "The People", everything, put all of your shit on your lawn and allow random people who you deem have less than you to use/take/borrow whatever for how long they want.

Please tell me why I or anyone else is under ANY obligation to be forced to give our earnings and property away? By what legal right is that justifiable? My family gives to charities becasue we CHOOSE to, it is our money, and I'll be damned if I have someone who has never even LIVED in a communist nation tell me to become a communist. Bump that. You can scream technicallity all you want, but I was born in a Soviet bloc nation, and what my family went through and millions of others was ungodly. Go start communism on some privative island somehwere and if people want to go, let them come to you, don't drag the rest of us into poverty with you. That is the epitome of hypocrisy: To sit there and have the audacity to want to order us to give our earnings away when YOU HAVE NOT EVEN DONE SO YET. Who are you waiting for? What are you waiting for, some mythical revolution? Please. It's funny how most people in capitalistic societies become successfull, middle class citizens, but you want everyone to be economically and eqaully poor. Bullshit.

Practice what you preach. If you want people to follow your suit, guess what, take up your cause and be leaders. We're waiting.

 

No we don't. This is stupid.

I am willing to give my life away in order to see all those imperialist yankees in Iraq and in the White House dead and executed. Is that good enough for you, punk?

 

No. It's not. And stop trying to change the subject.

Rather than causing violence, why don't you actually practice the ideals that YOU CLAIM communism stands for - an equal standard of living for everyone? You have not yet made a convincing argument as to why you don't give everything you own to charity.

Personally, I don't want the government (or "the people", or any other entity but myself) owning my toothbrush. Under communism, that's exactly what would happen.

You, sir, are a dumbass. Communism has failed everywhere it has been tried, without a single exception.

 

Stupid? The only thing that is stupid here is you. You cannot even address simple points brought up by everyone on here. What are you waiting for? Don't talk the talk, walk the walk. Put all of your shit on your front lawn and say, "I am a communist, I am giving back to the community, everyone enjoy." You want everyone else forced to give their stuff away, when you have not even done so, yourself, hypocrite. You honestly expect other people to join your cause when you cannot even practice it? What's the matter, can't afford it? Yeah, wake up to the real world, most people cannot afford to do that and do not want to. Your ideology is a complete farse.

This has absolutley nothing to do with communsim, moron. No doubt you are a Western European, this sentiment is typical, and the rest of the world is fed up with this elitist attitude. As I said before, go found your own commune, and see how many people want to go there, don't force the rest of us to accept your unfair ideology based on theft.

 

I'll tell you what's stupid. Under Saddam, the communists were executed. As soon as the Americans go in, the communist party becomes legal.

Now we have european communists who want to go to Iraq to kill Americans.

This guy is the embodiment of communist stupidity. He is generous but only with other people's money and wants to promote political violence against the very people that brought freedom for communists in Iraq.

 

I will practice what I believe in, and I do. But what we need is to change the system, not to give away our television. Like I said, when slavery existed in the US, it would not have helped in the long run to give a slave a few dollars. Slavery itself must be forbidden. Get the point?


When I will, for instance, give away my money to a leftist guerilla in South America or Africa, then I will help and invest in people's future. They will, when receiving power for example, distribute land (take from the wealthy, give to the poor, and to ), help the average guy.


I guess you reformists have no idea what I'm talking about. Or do you?

Do you see why I am writing this?

Wow, now this is intelligent.

And so is yours.

I am not an elitist. I am egalitarian.


The rest of the world is fed up with American mentality. Wake up, Joe!

 

If that's true, I have respect for that. But I do not care very much if the communist party is allowed or not. The communist party is just a tool in order to progress to a classless and democratic society. What I care about is the proletariat (working class), not the communist party itself.

 

Just curious, I wonder what people on here think of Chavez. I know he is not really a communist but he does do a great deal of wealth redistribution. Does anyone know how extensive wealth redistribution is under his leadership?

I bring him up because Hugo Chavez is well liked by many people I respect who call themselves "capitalists", but others call him a " communist" and I can't find any commentary between the two extreems of opinion.

 

He is no communist, just an authoritarian who likes heavy state intervention in the economy.

I think his poverty distribution has been more effective than his wealth distribution, but that's usually how it goes.

 

Hugo Chavez is a terrible, terrible leader, and I must say I was extremely disappointed when he survived the recall vote. I would have assumed it was fraudulent, but Jimmy Carter and a whole lot of election watchdog groups said it was legitimate, and I don't think they'd have any reason to lie...

Chavez is an authoritarian statist who has made Venezuela less free and more poor over the course of his rule. He shuns the notion of Western democracy, instead preferring the company of dictators like Saddam Hussein, Fidel Castro, and Moammar Qadaffi.

Until Venezuela rejects the notion of socialism, it will remain the poorest country in South America.

 

Doesn't matter. It has to start somewhere. How can you expect the system to change when you do not do your part? Now be a good communist and allow everyone to have access to your home, property, and assets.

Sort of like calling me a punk is intelligent, right?

Not really, since our system works. Every time yours was attempted it failed, miserably, and people suffered for it.

Your Western European attitude is elitist, maybe you not personally.

Joe?

 

Interesting how factual reality fails to adhere to your obviously partisan-inspired assessment of their economic ranking...

Rank/Country/GDP per capita (US Dollars)
1 Chile 12,400
2 Argentina 10,000
3 Uruguay 8,500
4 Venezuela 8,000
5 Colombia 6,200
6 Brazil 6,150
7 French Guiana 6,000
8 Peru 4,400
9 Ecuador 4,300
10 Paraguay 3,650
11 Suriname 3,400
12 Bolivia 3,000
13 Guyana 2,500

http://www.aneki.com/south_america_richest.html

Richer than Columbia and Brazil in point of fact.

Further food for thought...

http://www.morphizm.com/politix/palast/palast_chavez.html

 

Chaves, well, I think it could be said that he is a social democrat, but I've heard that the people is forcing him to become more leftist then he really wants to, so now his position is perhaps somewhere in the line between social democrat (capitalist) and democratic socialism (socialist)...

 

Yes, it does matter. To have real change you have to do things that will change things. I do give money away to poor people, and I think that's good, but that's not the point: It will NOT change the system that is making these people poor.

That has nothing to do with communism and communist thought, to let everyone go into my house and do whatever they want. In a communist society you will still have personal property (house, garden, television piano, newspapers, toothbrush etc.) in a communist society too.

 

"My" attitude? Feel free to elaborate.

 

How much do you know? I'm just curious because the news sources I trust the most paint a better picture than you do of Mr Chavez. BBC news, for example, has a more balanced perspective, probably meant not to anger either side. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/country_profiles/1229345.stm

Some of the Venezuelan press is anti-Chavez, but trusting them is tricky when you consider WHO owns the press.

"A small group of businessmen own fifteen television stations in Venezuela. Only six of these stations are national, and the rest are local channels. Three of the local stations, Televisora Andina de Mérida, Canal de los Niños Cantores del Zulia and Vale TV belong to the Catholic Church. There is only one public television station with a national broadcasting frequency, Venezolana de Televisión (or Channel 8), and growing community media stations, such as Catia TVe and Bocon have an extremely limited range. During several decades, commercial television in Venezuela has belonged to an oligopoly of two families, the Cisneros, who own Venevisión, and the Bottome & Granier Group, which owns Radio Caracas Televisión (RCTV) and Radio Caracas Radio. Against the determined opposition of these two families, Televen, Globovisión, CMT and La Tele were able to enter the private media market, although the latter two only have VHF frequency, with limited reach."

http://www.venezuelanalysis.com/articles.php?artno=1283

And if you read the MANY interesting articles on truthout.com you can tell that the poor of his country do appear to support him. Perhaps they are making a mistake they will pay for in the years to come, but I just want to point out there is a debate out there as to whether he is a "terrible leader"

truthout.com

I am curious how extensive his use of wealth distribution is and how much it infringes on the rights of his countrymen because in my searches I have yet to find that information. I am also curious of what other ways he infringes on or limits the rights of his citizens. I hear alot of vague claims about how he is a horrible leader but very little proof.

Painting an even more interesting picture, it seems that Bush knew of the 2002 coup that momentarily overthrew him before it occured.
http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=04/11/29/1448220&mode=thread&tid=25


While I don't endorse "Communism" as it has manifested in authoritarian societies, I believe that we should be able to accept a diversity of social organizations within democracies. However those who want to experiment with social organization might think to start out on the small scale and build upwards, like Kandahar suggests, rather than forcing your way on others. I started a thread in the "protest" forum a while back on the many ways people are building another society "within" our society.

 

Actually, societies called "communist" are for the most part socialists (for instance China under Mao). These countries have never claimed to be communist, only socialist (I can give you a link of the Soviet constitution if you like).



Communism in itself is a very de-centralized society, stateless society.


Why?

Because communists believe a transitional fase is needed in order to reach communism, and that is socialism.






Just wanted to point that out.


Peace

 

That is why I meant in "how it was manifested in authoritarian societies". I am still waiting to see how different social systems work within democracies and keeping an open mind.

I do wonder sometimes if Bush supporters are communist, because he has done more to support communist governments and weaken capitalism than any US president before him

 

I don't know anything about this Aneki website, but the CIA World Factbook is the internet standard for most statistics regarding nations. Venezuela's per capita income in 2003 was $4,800, and had an abysmal -9.2% economic growth compared to the world average of 4-5%.

 

hey i come from finland so i kinda of get your point of view. apparently there are still a lot of people in russia too who want communism back. but i think lot of people want communism back only as something to oppose capitalism with. i think communism would work better if it actually was organised properly, less extreme and not a selfish system like it was in "russia"