Racists? conservative or liberal? JFK, RFK, MLK. Killed by conservatives or liberals? Mariners that set out across the seas 150, 500, 1000, years ago? conservative or liberal? Costco versus Walmart? Which is conservative -which is liberal? (hint=Costco pays up to 18 an hour, walfuckmart pays 8 to 10 or 11. Who ships the jobs overseas while millions lose their houses, jobs and dignity? Conservative or liberal? Who doesn't care about the people that have lost their houses, jobs and dignity? Conservative or liberal? Who thinks half(47%) don't want to work, but just take? Bankers who ripped this country off and almost brought the world economy down--conservative or liberal? I hope I can see a fuckin' post without mention of Obama. Pissin' in the wind on that one. Just a few for consideration.
What happens when you scrap the welfare state – Pure anarchy! The poor and starving will rise up against the government and the powers-that-be will have to respond in force. The FEMA camps will be on standby waiting to receive its first non-essential americans and written above the entrance gate: Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses yearning for free handouts; The wretched refuse of your teeming cities, Send these, the homeless, Tempest-tossed to me I lift my lamp beside the golden door! And slam it shut in the vein of democracy Hotwater
Well, true capitalism doesn't exist. What we have today is a hodgepodge of crony/monopoly capitalism, corporatism and socialism. Those on the left demonize capitalism, as if what we have is true free market capitalism, then they cry for a solution that entails even more government intervention and manipulation of the economy than we have already, which has created so many of the problems we're faced with today. Meanwhile, none of these people have a clue about how the economy works, or how money comes into existence in the first place. They don't care about tackling real issues, only the talking points they heard on MSNBC or read on Huffington Post. I am not saying that conservatives are any better, because there are no true conservatives in Washington, and most of the general public who considers themselves to be conservative are not. Republicans are NOT conservative. Liberalism and conservatism are two heads of the same hydra. One could not exist without the other.
You want to argue mainstream media talking points it seems. First off, most people don't believe Lee Harvey Oswald killed Kennedy. You are in the minority if you believe that tripe, and quite gullible to boot. Also, the bankers are all hardcore socialist/communuist/globalists who HATE competition and champion global governance and big authoritarian government to control the population. Liberals are their biggest tools since they support everything the globalists want to implement. You need a BIG government to control the masses. Big government is what liberalism is all about. I am not saying that average liberals want what the controllers want, but they get behind causes that play into what the controllers want, which is why I refer to them as dupes.
I never said we were in nature; I believe i called us a civilized society.(I'm not sure why though) But actually, we wouldn't. In Ancient Rome, the average life span was something like 19 years old. There have been 13 year old kings in the past. Moreover, where are these lands that corporations are rending useless? I find it odd that again, you hate when corporations do it, but government doing is is perfect fine- The government has Nuclear testing sites, right here in the US. They've also Nuked Japan causing Nuclear fallout to spread in the water. And you support these guys, but hate corporations. Dude! Wtf are you talking about? Money is just used as a good to trade. The reason Dollars are worthless, is because we've come off the gold standard; so they are literally debt paper with no real value. But anyway, any society uses money in place of old-school trading. So of course you can't go mark your land, and build a farm free. Plus, most if not all land is already owned by private land owners. No society is truly free today. But, the Libertarian party is the closest you can get, not Liberalism which focuses more power and control with our forceful governments than the people. People are not alcoholics cause they "can't get ahead in life." Even rich people are alcoholics. I never said people deserve to be poor- but people who don't do a single thing for society, do deserve to be. If they aren't willing to get a job or contribute, why should the people who are willing to work, pay for them? That's why I call the "greater good," an excuse; Because it is. You have one person, sitting on their butt, collecting government benefits, then, you have the working/middle class Americans who bust their ass just to barely make it by. Why should the people willing to work, live in the same standards of those who refuse? This is the big lie of Liberalism...
It's a TOTAL waste when you FORCE ANOTHER burden on the taxpayer, when we are 17 trillion in debt, and it's GOVERNMENT pre k, with more government teachers and, more WASTE. Yes, government-run pre k is an utter waste of money, and just goes to show how insane Liberalism is, to force the taxpayer to pay, for some other peoples DAYCARE! Actually, I said it's the same thing, and it's true! Liberalism requires the Military-industrial Complex to keep the fiat money system going. They also want to massively expand government, and give out the TAXPAYERS money, when we are already 17 trillion dollars in debt. Liberals just perpetuate the state we're in, despite Liberals lying to themselves and pretending its all "humanitarian" efforts. Liberalism makes the government much bigger and more invasive. They get scared when I say shrink government. But the facts are that if we dont CUT spending, this country will over-extend ourselves and devalue or currency so much, that we will collapse like Ancient Rome. And Liberalism does nothing to stop that, and infact Ted Turner is a Liberal who believes in killing people off, or limiting children like China. So obviously it's another elitest party! SHut up! ANYONE who doesn't like Obama, for ANY reason, is assumed to be racist by ignorant Liberals who totally ignore his disgusting abuses of power. *sarcasm*You know what, I hate him 100% because he's black, it has virtually nothing to do with him trampling our Constitution, Killing Citizens, Lying repetitively, instituting laws that go against our founding principles or, his attempt to disarm the country. No it's entirely because he's black
the scraping of a welfare net would mean no protection for some of the most vunerable people in all societys.it would be insane and inhumane.
I highly doubt you know everyone responsible for the murder of these individuals. Does costco give an extra 50% in taxes, since they are so Liberal, and think the government should be bigger? This is garbage. It's probably both Liberals and Republicans! It's so ignorant to think republicans are the ONLY ones who do these things is completely misinformed! Romney was the one who said that thing about freeloaders- I'm not a Romney supporter, but to Obama supporters, anyone who doesn't like Obama MUST be a republican who likes the other guy Considering the wealthiest county in this country voted for Obama, I'd say they are Liberals, or opportunists. And of course you would LIKE for me not mention Obama, because he is a Liberal failure. You have NO problem bringing up Republican failures, but of course, pointing out a Liberal who murders 16 year old kids in "pissing in the wind," but falsely blaming republicans for things you have no idea of, is supposed to be a legit argument! Psshhh!
Hey congrats on figuring out how to not mention Obama in one of your posts! I don't know what your point about lifespans is, but you're wrong-- the average was lower in the past because of the infant mortality rate, but overall the length of most life spans has not changed... all that has changed if your odds of surviving childhood. And I have no idea why you're talking about WWII and all of this other stuff... I'm not saying that every single government that has ever existed has been wonderful and I'm definitely not defending the bombing of Hiroshima. You just keep making this shit up! And I read just today that 3.3 million hectares of land in China is unfit for farming, thanks to industrial pollution... though in reality it's closer to 24 million. This is because there are almost no governmental regulations on the environment. Do you honestly think that the farmers are capable of standing up to the rich and powerful industrialists? Why do you think that deregulating everything is going to produce a different result in America, especially since America is one of the WORST countries for pollution... and when you take into account the practices that the America-based internationals are directly responsible for in other countries including China, I really have to wonder why you think that lowering the west's standards to those of a third world country is going to produce a different result. You think they'll take it easy on you because you're an American? You don't need to keep telling me what you think Liberalism is... I get it. My point is that if you gave everyone 'freedom' then it wouldn't mean that everyone is just automatically empowered, and it definitely wouldn't mean that anyone who works hard would get ahead. Plenty of people work hard and don't get ahead. People at MacDonald's work their asses off and get a shitty wage. All that 'freedom' would mean is the strong/rich are now free to exploit and enslave the weak/poor. That's how nature works... if someone is weak and no one helps them, they will be eaten. Before you dole out the whole 'but that happens now' line... I don't think you realize just how many things you take for granted and just how much worse it could get for you without anyone looking after you. Your gun isn't going to save you from rich industrialist drones in a completely unregulated state. ALL of your 'rights' would disappear pretty quickly... all of that wealth that you hate giving the government wouldn't end up in your hands... it would go straight to the corporations and you would end up a serf in a feudal state, serving your lord for scraps. If rich people are alcoholics then why were you bringing up alcoholics as an example of people who don't get ahead in life/are being supported by the state? This is a narrative the right always spins, but they don't produce any actual evidence of this and they don't ever think to look into the causes/psychology of poverty and just adopt the 500-year old 'these people are lazy' bullshit. If welfare is so awesome, then why don't you quit your job and go on welfare? You honestly think that these people have it made?
You support the government, and want them to get bigger, yet, they are involved in some of the most violent events in the history of the world. Is it? Or is it because they burn more coal than any other country? And did they say WHY it is unusable? America is killing off honey bee's and putting citizens/nature at risk with GMO's. Through a Government-protected corporation. So, it's okay for the government to shit on the envoirment, but, has a pass to "punish" others for doing so? Not as long as the government is in bed with said powerful industrialists. Government is the one who uses the force. And anyway, corporations cant just steal someones land, you're purposely blowing my words way out of proportion to play it off like I believe in something I don't. There's nothing stoppind industrialists now from buying up all the land. 7000$ is junk change to the elite- meaning, they can start a new business with pocket change. It is the small business owners that get hurt when we raise taxes. Now, small time employees will be FORCED to pay extra taxes for each employee, Obamacare for each employee and, the corporate income tax (which is a double-tax.) That means, if I wanted to start a business today (which Id like to,) it would cost near 20 grand, just to get it up and going, because of government regulations. In 1913, there was only 400 pages of tax codes; Today, there's more than 73 thousand. Not only that, but wages have gone down, and prices have gone up. http://www.zerohedge.com/sites/defa...root/2013/11/20131122_nopenoinflationhere.jpg I'm not saying people shouldn't help other people, but it's wrong for the government to steal from one group of people, to give it to another group. If you work, but you don't make enough to live, you're not entitled to foodstamps anyway. It's only people who refuse to work or go to school, who receive these government benefits. Because of higher taxes, higher prices and, the dollars lower value, the middle class is living like poor people, while the poor and very rich receive their hard-earned money. How is that fair? If Liberals cared about the citizens, they would worry about the middle class, instead of worrying about people who can miraculously pay rent, but can't buy their own food. It literally makes no sense. You have to have a house and be paying rent to receive food stamps, but you cant have a job or go to school. To me, it sounds like we're encouraging people to stay dependent on government funding. I don't have a problem with Alcoholics, as long as you aren't getting your lively hood in the expense of the taxpayer. Why should I buy foodstamps for some low-life to sell it half price for drugs? You say I'm just "assuming," but actually, I've seen MANY of these people before. From NY to TN, there are people who pay their bills by selling the pills they got from government insurance, or selling their foodstamps half-price. Secondly, I dont have a problem with poor people, just because they're poor. The problem isn't "poor" people, it's people who abuse the system, and collect a check despite the fact that they could work and honest living, but refuse to, and instead force someone else to pay for their stupid life choices. If someone's not working, going to school, contributing to society etc, then, they are not "entitled" to someone elses money who does work hard, and earned it. Liberals talk about how low minimum wage is, but even when I was making 10$ an hour, it still came out to around 7 after taxes, not to mention sales tax. Shit, by the time I pad taxes, I barely had enough money to feed myself, yet, I was paying $400 a month for some other family to live off my hard earned money. I'm not a greedy person. If I see someone starving on the street, I'll buy them food. I don't want people to starve, but the victim in todays society is the citizens who labor and pay toward this government, and get nothing back. In the last few years, I'm sure normally working/middle class individuals lost their job and was pushed onto foodstamps. That's why I said foodstamps is about the last thing Id abolish. But, to suggest Welfare is the only way to take care of these people, well, I don't agree. I think Charities and churches are more effective, because it isn't a forceful theft, but a voluntary help effort. I never called it "awesome," and I doubt I ever would. Plus, I can't cause how do you not work and paying your rent, but cant afford food? To me, it sounds ideal for a Drug Dealer or something, but I'd go crazy sitting at the house 24-7, and relying on government every month to feed me. I'm smart enough to know that Foodstamps, will be one of the first things government cuts, as people start getting too broke to pay taxes.
Post 119. And no-- Oswald couldn't hit much of anything he shot at. He fired 'marksman in the service, which is not the best--Expert is. If he hit Kennedy--it was once. And there is socialism for the rich and capitalism for the rest of us. And for that matter-I'm not strictly a liberal. And for another matter--not that it was required in this thread, because it wasn't---some of you folks have zero sense of humor. It shows here and other posts day after day---some for years. Be that as it may---as one human to you others, I hope sincerely that 2014 brings all that will be helpful to you-all that and happiness to boot. I've lived too long to keep jackin' around in the political BS. When I've posted on here for over a decade and others , such as rat still addresses me as if I haven't heard his line again and again and he mine---I've wasted my time for sure. Gets tiresome. But carry on, gentleman. Again-post 19. Always wanted to end a post withe number 19.
You either made this up, or got it from a very bias website. First of all, our founding protected Human Rights and freedoms; Liberalism does nothing of the sort. Think logically about it; Liberals do not wish to change the current power structure, but instead, boost it up with more money and more wasteful programs. Ted Turner believes in killing citizens/limiting children and, you believe that is freedom? Unrestrained also includes not being FORCED to pay massive amounts of money for stupid programs, and being able to defend yourself. Liberalism, if anything, helps to take freedoms and our Constitution away. No Liberals seem to care about the Constitution when Obama violates it. He's the same type of war monger Bush is- oh, but he IS black, and like 50% worse...
I know, and I'm sure some Republicans did have to do with it. (George HW. Bush, Nixon etc.) but you can't pretend that LBJ is some innocent party in all this... You say "sincerely, " but it seems back-handed to me. It's hard to be happy with the world around you, when corporations control our policies, and our basic human Rights keep being taken by oligarchs. Ive been here 2 years already. You and I have been back-and-forth a few times. But the thing is, everyday that passes, me and Rat have more proof that the government is corrupted, and going against the people. And everyday, Obama supporters have less and less of an excuse for him. Liberals have less and less reason to trust the government. Sensible people can see politic as the theatrical propaganda it is. I'm not conservative or Liberal- I'm a Libertarian, and we strongly believe in Human Rights and freedoms. Liberals act like it's ALL left-vs-right, even while talking to Libertarians, who don't identify with either party. The only reason we are branded with republicans is because we believe in our Right to Bear arms, and shrinking government. But, mainstream Republicans wont protect either of those things, and Democrats are totally against them. Meanwhile, it is government that's destroying our country!
I see; the end in mind for the "natural Society" is to scrap the welfare state. Nevertheless, Obama has for his agenda the consequences of what comes about in the most unbelievable worth of governance for that happening. People just naturally work; and even Marx said so in the Das Kapital. There is no natural society is my view. The welfare state is about the natural condition by which man conforms His human condition to the reasonable Nature of the sane person needing to Work for a living. One may not work for some time of the events of his life, but the human condition operates that he perceives the means of production more clearly than ever in that state of welfare OR belonging to a Vocation of human nature required of the State. Thus the welfare state is never to be scrapped from the state of Nature; or is it? we have the morals coming from the science applied to the nature training Man in the mores of progress and the mores of Progress determine that the civilization is never adequately "scientific" to Knowledge and Trust in how civilized Man is to conduct his business of teaching men and women (and eunichs, if you like) to work. We may also be regarded not to make progress in literally human nature. Can such be even meaningful as of purely a welfare state?
There is more than one government in the world. It's not okay for anyone to shit on the environment. The pollution in China is from heavy metals... and you were defending coal earlier in this thread. It's unusable because there's cadmium in the groundwater... you're not supposed to eat cadmium. GMOs have nothing to do with heavy metal pollution... you're just bringing this shit up because you need to change the subject again. Why do you think the rich don't own more land? Could it possibly be because of the taxes that they would have to pay? Taxes that then go into the education system? Either that or it's because it's worthless. Under Libertarian rule, the rich would have complete control over the economy and could simply manipulate the lower classes with wages and prices. Without a land tax, the schools would fall apart, and only the rich would be able to afford an education. They're already driving up the cost of housing, health care (in the US) and child care. As it stands, all of this land is polluted NOT for the benefit of the masses but for the benefit of a few businessmen who bought the property to make a profit. You seriously think that making it easier for them to exploit these properties is going to HELP the environment? Or that they shouldn't have to give anything back to the communities that they're polluting? So yeah, maybe a few people have jobs for a couple of years and then they move on and leave the place a polluted shithole and everyone gets sick and can't work, can't afford health care (the rates are too high because the rich have been driving the price up, and there is no help from the government on that one-- those lazy cancer patients need to get out there and WORK for a living) and there's literally nothing that they can do about it, because there are no regulations they can't work to afford money for a lawyer, and they can't afford doctors (no job, too sick to work). Obama again?! If you want to attack a health care system... why don't you attack Canada's? Progressive income tax means everyone gets free universal health care, all at the same high standard. You have a perverse need to make every single thread about America and Americans. Yes, and it's all because the government is forcing the corporations to cut jobs and lower salaries, right? The corporations couldn't possibly be responsible for their own decisions! I'm not even going to address the rest... I get the whole 'don't steal muh moneys' thing. It's too exhausting to have to explain the same shit over and over.
One last post. Post 119 came straight from my dictionary. AND IRONICALLY--rat just doesn't remember--I have agreed with much of what he maintains --YEARS AGO. It's just too silly to continue here. No---I wish you-all a happy new year. For real.
So what is Obama's view that makes the health insurance a "welfare state" refuser as opposed to Hillary Clinton's? That is since the original election. In Canada it really was not a welfare state to have children deliberately to collect welfare. That IS a swindle.
Of course, but the UN has a pretty good grip on all their balls, don't they? I wasn't defending them- I believe i said that Regulations on coal, help the oil industry. Meanwhile, the oil industry is constantly having spills, including: The BP spill, the oil train derailment and, dozens of 'unreported' spills in NH. They seem to have no problems destroying the environment either. On top of that, Government did do anything to Koch Chemicals, which improperly stored cancer-causing substances outside, to blow in the wind. Moreover, GeoEngineering is the Liberal's way of 'stopping' global warming. In case you don't know, this is when they spray allunimum and other metal particles in the air, which in turn, poisons our lakes/ponds and, puts people at a higher health risk. Actually, we were talking about the environment and regulations therein. By that standard, everything I said was true, and makes sense- GMO's are killing off all the honey bee's, and is proven to cause cancer after 2 short years of ingestion by rats.. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Njd0RugGjAg"]GMO, Global Alert - YouTube I don't think it has anything to do with taxes. Rich people aren't struggling with taxes- the top 1% owns 80% of the wealth, and I don't think anything is stopping them from buying it all up, except they have no use for land. They'd probably prefer land in Afghanistan, where they can grow opium for American's to buy up. Or, in the middle east, with tons of oil to sell back to America. Corporate America is undoubtibly the reason a majority of the world is still poor. They NEED control of the local governments, to buy up all their land and natural resources. Nothing is "stopping" them. In fact, our government works with their agenda, assaninating Democratically-elected leaders and replacing them with Dictators or Washington puppets. This is the evil establishment, that Libertarianism would drop out of, and return to a sovereign Nation, with our own Rights, instead of what George HW. Bush called a "New World Order." (Which is only the UN and biggest corporate scumbags, turning the world into a business of natural resources.) This is total lies! The thing that drives costs up is government involvement. and nearly everything you mentioned is a PRIME example of that. College Tuition has skyrocket since government started "loans," and they are making billions in profit doing it. The cost of housing is another government bubble, in which the elite lowered interest rates and prices to sell homes, and encouraged the Banks to give out more loans; Many people were unable to pay their loans back, and that's what cause the economic recession of 2008. Healthcare, is up so high, because government has had "free" insurance for 40 years. Now it costs 65$ for one vicoden at the hospital. It's also well over a grand, just to go 10 miles in an ambulance. This is because companies know whatever they charge, government will have to pay it. Less people have insurance today, than before the government got involved. Moreover, government going away doesn't mean we couldn't afford all this, actually, prices would DROP due to competition and Americans inablity to pay. Do you think ANYONE has 20 grand to drop, on 1 semester of school? The rich are already the only ones who can afford an education, and it's completely because of government. I never said any of that. I think if companies are destroying land that doesn't belong to them, they should be in serious trouble for theft. All that's happening now, is legalized bribery. They dump because they know if the get caught once in a while, EPA fines are A LOT less than disposing of waste properly. That's an incentive to disregard the enviorment, because of the inhabitence protecting it, we leave it in the hands of people who are likely to accept bribes. In the hands of the people, businesses would be much more liable. They are liable for damage done to others property, and others health. And that is more than you can say for the current US government. What are you talking about?? Are you expecting Government to give out "free" lawyers now?? Well, they do in criminal cases, and I think some of the Elite should be tried in criminal court. But, it's not right to indiscriminately steal money from the rich, just because they're rich. There's many rich people who don't do corrupt things, however, Liberalism seems to think they're all bad. Really the people you need to worry about are: the Banks, (they control our dollars,) the Defense industry, (people like Halliburton.) The oil industry, (that needs perpetual war, to carry out their agenda,) and Monsanto who controls 90% of America's food, but manipulated the FDA into not labeling GMOs,( or release any studies not conducted by Monsanto.) And, the pharmaceutical industries who lobby our government, to maintain total control over peoples medications and livelyhood. But all these industries I mentioned, work through government. Government is their way of getting rich, keeping other down etc. The Libertarian system would have these people tried in court, like any other no-good criminal. We literally have a Death Panel for a government in 2014. Government or corporations are not above the law, and neither them or any individual would legally initiate violence (except by way of mutual conflict.) You act like I just want no laws, no government, no taxes- and that's not entirely true. I want the Fair Tax. With that money, I want government to protect life, Liberty and, property, and get out of our lives after that. You say I'm wrong, but think about it. Right now people are in danger of getting cancer or having children born with birth defects. The government does nothing now, to protect your property. People die and get paralyzed everyday- even by the H1N1 shot, that was endorsed by government. The only hope those people have today, is a lawyer that will take their cases free. And it happens a lot. I was part of a class-action lawsuit against Best Buy for example, and I was charged nothing. We have a need for healthcare because government intrusion has bombarded the marketplace 40 years ago, and prices have gone up since. I've already addressed this as well. As for Canada; I don't live there, I cant tell those individuals what they want, but most importantly, from what I can tell, their government doesn't spend 60% of it's spending on military Nope, they don't spend near as much... Actually, yeah! Federal minimum wage is like 7.50$ an hour; That's a price set by government, not corporations. But in the meantime, they are non-stop printing money and handing it out to everyone but the people, and we're heading toward a collapse in that way. Not only that, but Libertarianism doesn't let corporations do whatever they want, and as long as you keep thinking that, you'll never understand it. We don't want to punish people just because they're rich. We want people to be able to save there money, and, put it in their kids college funds, invest in a business, buy stocks- more money in the hands of the people, creates opportunity. Where are you from? Because you don't seem to understand American principles. As far as taxes goes, the government wastes most the money it takes in. We get little to nothing back for our hard work and effort. Government has made it where we are working for 7.50 an hour, but taking home 5.50 after taxes. It's totally insane and unlivable. The problem is the Federal Government, Social security (who is stockpiling ammunition) and, the police state that is being built around us. That was one of the reasons for our succession, and a big reason for the Boston tea party. Obviously you're not American though, because our Founding Document and principles seem to mean nothing to you...
Malarky! :biker: The majority of mcdonalds workers are on foodstamps. Not only that, Wallmart and Mcdonalds both allegedly have programs helping their wage-slaves sign up for snap and other welfare.