Women's rights, or Islam?

Ah, those "either-or"dichotomies again. How are the Muslims a huge threat to liberal human rights accomplishments in the United States, when they make up about 1% of the U.S. population? About one in four Americans, on the other hand, is an evangelical Christian, and they make up the core of the Republican voting base. The biggest threat to freedom and civil rights in the United States comes from Trump and his supporters, especially rightwing Bannonites who put up abominations like Roy Moore as our lawmakers. The radical rightwingers continue to chip away at voting rights for African-Americans and the advances made by women and gays. I don't think "the Christians" are a threat to human rights accomplishments at all, because "the Christians" , like "the Muslims" come in many different flavors. I'm a Christian myself. Those Muslims who kill Muslims in the name of a false Islam are indeed going against their religion. Terrorism and suicide are against Islam.
That was a mosque in Egypt that the ISIS bastards wiped out, and the worshipers were Sufis, who don't conform at all to your stereotype of Muslims. We face the challenge in a complex world of living with a diversity of faiths, some of them messed up. We can magnify and harp on their perceived deficiencies under the phony guise of "constructive criticism", in the full knowledge that fanning the flames of hatred at this time in history could result in violence and suffering. Or we can try understanding. To win the war on terrorism, we're going to need lots of Muslim help, and the Trumpsters and Muslim baiters are making it more difficult. Officials worry that U.S counterterrorism defenses will be weakened by Trump actions
You don't fool anybody with your "constructive criticism" schtick. You're scapegoating Muslims to further a demagogic agenda:today, Muslim women in hijabs; tomorrow, American women in pants suits comin for our cojones; then Black lives matter; then Antifa-; then repeat cycle. But pay no attention to those Nazis over there, or that orange man behind the curtain who's about to lighten your wallet and offer you a scholarship to Trump U.

 

When women in the Islamic world face clitorectomies, and acid splashing for attempting to get an education, how can both coexist this day in age?

Back when alt-right was brand new, pre-2016 election, it meant something different. This old article from early 2016, although long, explains what many people though they were initially. No mention of Richard Spencer. An Establishment Conservative's Guide To The Alt-Right But the media gave the 1488'ers all of the spot light and representation of the alt-right, and soon it permanently became a synonym for neo-nazi. For that reason, nowadays I think the alt-right can go fuck themselves.

Not all, but according to the statistics I've shown you, about 1/3rd of them in your country support all the negative aspects of Islamic law and cultural lifestyle. And much more support similar but lesser atrocities. 2/3 admit they won't report a plot to commit an act of terrorism ffs.

I'm non-religious too. I'm an agnostic because I have personally experienced some bizarre metaphysical stuff that science cannot explain. Atheists seem to deny any of this stuff exists, but I think there's a part of the universe that we don't know about.

Discussing forbidden topics and hurting feelings =/= spreading hate.

I may be a long of things, but I'm not far right. That would make me an Evangelical or an Islamist.

I don't see everyone to the left of me as a Stalinist. However, I feel that your blind faith in "good governance" leads to Stalinist societies.

As I've told you before, I get along with plenty of people to the left of me who support a blend of capitalism and socialism. I may think that anarcho-capitalism/minarchism may be the best way to go, but it won't be achievable since too many people won't allow it because they fear what they don't understand. Thus, I think compromises can be made; I'll give in to moderate amounts of regulation. In my experience, many people of the center left have a better live-and-let live philosophy than those of the far right. For that reason I believe I get along better with people of the center left than I do with people of the fringe right.

 

This explains perfectly how you mislead yourself.

 

To me a modern leftist is someone who puts people in assigned groups, stripping them of their individuality. A promoter of identity politics and the oppression olympics. A belief where victimhood is the highest virtue to be had. A regressive rather than a progressive. Someone who thinks force by any means necessary is justified against someone spouting off opinions different than their own.

In short, liberal is a good word, leftist is not. Especially a regressive leftist. I find that regressive left has turned lots of good liberals into vile people and have chased lots of good spirited people away from left-wing causes.

True liberalism is defense of free speech, individual rights, and human liberty. Regressiveism is the direction the left wing is heading.

 

It's just two examples. You don't have to look very far to find similar incidents throughout Europe that've happened since 2015.

 

That sounds like you. "Leftists", "Muslims", "Black Lives Matter", "Antifa", etc. Paint with a broad brush. Face it. You're a propagandist for AltRight white male identity politics.

 

Meh, I’m not gonna lose any sleep over your misrepresentations of me. You’re free to think what you want.

Yep, they’re a bunch of D.I.L.D.O.S..

Desperate Intolerant Leftists Destroying Our Society

 

6

Reading your replies it is clear you have nothing of substance to contribute it’s just a series of propaganda statements and slogans.

True liberalism…..regressive leftist….. identity politics…. oppression Olympics…. and so on and so on…Oh and all left wing ideas lead to Stalisnism.

You claim you are not now a member of the alt-right because they have become associated with the far right and you don’t want to be thought of as far right although you do have and promote certain far right ideas like your Social Darwinist views and ‘free market’ anarcho-captitalism and the way you characterise anyone to the left of your position as a Stalinist (oh sorry not Stalinists just creators of Stalinism).

You say you just want to discuss ‘forbidden topics’ but then refuse to discuss them as soon as your views don’t seem to stand up to scrutiny.

As I say your ideas seem to lack substance so when given the chance to defend them from criticism it seems your only option is to run away. The problem is that then you pop up somewhere else to again bang out your propaganda (again only in statement and slogan form) and once again crying out that you only want to discuss ‘forbidden topics’ when we all know that you will run away again as soon as the questions and criticism get too hot for you.

 

Yes, I think you've got him pegged. Textbook propaganda, using several the tricks of the trade: spin, binary choices, guilt by association, red herrings, sloganeering, diversion, oversimplfication, labeling, "us" vs. "them" rhetoric, scapegoating, straw person, repetitive drumbeat saturation, etc. Here's how to spot it:
http://www.rbs0.com/propaganda.pdf
https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/2014...opaganda-techniques-all-students-should-learn
How to Identify Fallacies
How to identify logical fallacies
Fourteen Propaganda Techniques Fox ''News'' Uses to Brainwash Americans

 

You really are that stupid.

 

I didn’t run away, the thread got locked. Big difference. Please try to be honest.

Okay then, I’ll ask you an honest question if you can give me an honest answer. If you’re not an authoritarian leftist or a “Stalinist,” to what extent do you believe the government should dictate the market? Does your philosophy offer any room for market freedom? Or just little bits and pieces of it?

At least I now distance myself from the alt-right and other terrible factions of it. People like you still have yet to denounce your support from left-wing terrorist groups like BAMN and others you’ve voiced your support for.

 

Again you give us false "either-or" choices: either "free market" or a managed "Stalinist"one.; either a laissez-faire libertarian politics or left-wing terrorism. It's hard to believe that these are "honest" views, as opposed to an ideologue's propaganda talking points. The "free market" is a myth. What we have in the United States and the rest of the world is oligopoly in the economy and, closely linked to it, oligarchy in the political arena--masquerading as the "free market" and "democracy", respectively. Oligopoly is a market dominated by a small number of firms who are "too big to fail". There are strong incentives for such firms to collude and engage in market sharing to stabilize markets, set prices and reduce risks. Most countries therefore have regulations to prevent anti-competitive practices, but these depend on the effectiveness and independence of national political leaders who are often highly dependent on campaign contributions from said corporations. Oligarchy is government by the few, especially despotic power exercised by a small and privileged group for corrupt or selfish purposes. According to Roberto Michels "iron low of oligarchy", oligarchy is inevitable in any institution, because power inevitably gravitates into the hands of an elite which is not representative of the "rank" and" file".
Americans in the top 1 percent average over 38 times more income than the bottom 90 percent, while those in the top 0.1 Americans at this lofty level are taking in over 184 times the income of the bottom 90 percent.The top 1 percent of America’s income earners have more than doubled their share of the nation’s income since the middle of the 20th century. American top 1 percent incomes peaked in the late 1920s, right before the onset of the Great Depression

Inequality in America is growing, even at the top. The nation’s highest 0.1 percent of income-earners have, over recent decades, seen their incomes rise much faster than the rest of the top 1 percent. Incomes in this top 0.1 percent increased 7.5 times between 1973 and 2007, from 0.8 percent to an all-time high of 6 percent. The Great Recession in 2008 did dampen this top 0.1 percent share, but only momentarily. The upward surge of the top 0.1 percent has resumed.

Between 1979 and 2007, paycheck income of the top 1 percent of U.S. earners exploded by over 256 percent. Meanwhile, the bottom 90 percent of earners have seen little change in their average income, with just a 16.7 percent increase from 1979 to 2014. The top 1% households in the United States controlled !0% of the income in 1950-80, but 20% of it today.

Both markets and political democracies are substantially less free now than they were in the twentieth century. The global economy is dominated by a few giant multinational corporations who operate beyond the effective reach of national governments. The rules of their competition are effectively controlled by the World Trade Organization and the International Monetary Fund. These same corporations, of course, are major players on the domestic national scene, where they are joined by a few lesser companies and large banks. At the state and local level, economies are particularly vulnerable to the decisions of these corporations to relocate or threaten to relocate their operations to rival communities who compete for business by a "race to the bottom" in environmental regulations, labor laws, and social policies. In U.S. national politics.

The oligopolists and oligarchs are increasingly able to dominate domestic politics through the use of campaign contributions. Gerrymandering of congressional districts and retention of the archaic electoral college gave us the minority rule we have today. This is why the national legislature in the United States has just pushed through a highly unpopular tax bill that favors business corporations and billionaires who are the largest campaign donors. The Koch Brothers, collectively worth over $100 billion are one of the top three polluters in the country. They spent lavishly to fund the Tea Party and to promote political candidates friendly to environmental deregulation. The Mercers are the bank rollers of Breitbart, while casino owner Sheldon Adelson backs candidates friendly to Israel. With that in mind, we might reframe the discussion to one more germane to the real world.

 

6

LOL – So every thread you have ever been in has been locked - pull the other one mate – I’ve gone and checked and you are the liar – again.

Do you think people don’t notice when you are being dishonest, that if you change threads people will forget?

READ THE POSTS – I’ve already explained my thinking – it’s in another of the discussions you’ve run away from.

For fuck sake man you ask me a question or to explain something and then when I do you refuse to read my replies and then lie that I haven’t given an answer – that is extremely dishonest.

Please come back to the discussion on economic models, its waiting for you. I’m away for a couple of weeks or so take the time to read up and not shit like Atlas Shrugged and the propaganda from things like CATO but real books on economics.

You could try ‘The Penguin History of Economic’ for background and ’23 Things they don’t tell you about Capitalism’ to give you sense of the criticisms in what was called 'a witty and timely debunking of some of the biggest myths surrounding the global economy’.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Penguin-Hi...8-2&keywords=the+penguin+history+of+economics

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Things-They-Dont-About-Capitalism/dp/0141047976

LOL – hell how can I stop supporting something I’ve never heard of until today

Yes you have distanced yourself from something (the alt-right) because it was found to have many Nazis in it, thing is that they were always in it, you seem to have distanced yourself from it only after it became common knowledge that it had many Nazis in it.

As I’ve pointed out you still seem to hold to far right ideas (Social Darwinist ideas and anarcho-capitalism to name two) so although you are not part of the ‘alt-right’ you are still part of the extreme right.

 

6

Again you produce nothing of substance just more propaganda and lies

And as pointed out you are still pushing that stale black and white mentality – it must be either ‘neo-liberalism’ or ‘Stalinism’ and the sweeping generalisations like implying that if you are a leftie then you MUST totally support left-wing terrorist groups.

As I say I’m off for a while take the time to study and think, and above all ask yourself the question – if you need to be dishonest to push your ideas, are they good ideas?

 

Enjoy your trip, but hurry back!

 

I had the same problem. I guess BAMN (By All Means Necessary) is a household word mainly for right wingers. It seems to be mainly a campus-based group with support from college and high school students & is into defending affirmative action programs. How many belong to it? I don't know. I certainly don't. The title turns me off, since it suggests implicit acceptance of violence. Apparently, they attracted attention in 2016 when they clashed with the neo-Nazi Traditonal Workers Party in Sacramento, CA. Bringing BAMN up in the context of the current discussion is just strange.

 

Heh, I didn't make BAMN up so why are you accusing me? lol

With a name like By Any Means Necessary, they seem to me like a more hatefully violent version of Antifa. Yvette Falarca is their spokesperson it seems.

On the other hand, Antifa on the surface sounds a lot more inviting. Anti-fascism? Hell yeah! I'm an anti-fascist too!

 

Oligopolies and monopolies exist because of government protection and corporate lobbying. In the freer market society, there's no such thing as too big to fail. And if something does fail, other investors will buy out the failed company's remaining assets, or if it's technologically obsolete then it fails because it neglected to evolve to cater to the demands of the rest of society.

Today's monopolies and oligiopolies exist because they're protected by the government through regulation of the marketplace, intelectual property law, and corporate welfare. Think about it, if you had a monopoly on fidget spinners in a free market economy, how are you going to stop me from starting my own fidget spinner company that takes business away from you? There's nothing you can do, unless you run and cry to the government for help.

I mean for fuck sake, the marketplace is sooo regulated by the food and beverage industry that police are kicking down children's lemonade stands because they don't have permits and business licenses Texas police shut down little girls’ lemonade stand

 

No, the last thread where this discussion was going on was locked, Balbus. That is before you had to change the topic of this thread and hijack it away from the paradox that is Islamic Feminism.

When threads die, it's not always because you won the battle. But if it makes you feel any better, sure, go chalk up another tally mark to your scoreboard every time the interest level is lost and doesn't exceed 40 pages.


Lets get back on topic shall we ?

Well I'm still waiting for you to address the elephant in the room named Venezuela, and the post-Chavez apocalypse they're going through.

Good governance doesn't hold up to scrutiny because the people elect good and bad governance back and forth like a pendulum.

I'd love to, but I'm very busy with a business that I'm building. If I have time, I'd love to read a few of these talking points from these anti-capitalists who are benefiting from capitalism by selling their books to us

But in all seriousness, I'll be open to reading stuff like that.

Sometimes, I wish Marx was a heinous dictator like all the people he inspired. That way, we could all conclude that his big ideas have been tried and it leads to inevitable disaster.

BAMN, Antifa, Black Bloc, 3 peas in the same pod.



Here are my political test results. I took it just for you all to see if you still think I'm fringe right:



The Political Compass

I've taken this test a few times. I usually fall in this general area. Sometimes I'm slightly more right depending on my mood.


Have fun in Italy. Hope you enjoy sipping lattes on your Venetian balcony. So jealous.

 

I'm just as libertarian as you.
But much, much further to the left lol