Your Beliefs Are Yours!

Like I say, most Professionals disagree with Occam.
Im sure there are a few who do agree with your theory though?

There were quite a few discussions, papers and theses written on this whole subject around the late 90's and it was sometimes dubbed 'The God Gene' or 'Hard Wired Faith'

Psychiatrists, Psychologists and all of 'Academia' did (Gernerally) agree humans were 'by nature' hard-wired to include a God in their mental, psychological 'make-up'.

One of the more successful books on it ->
http://www.the-tidings.com/2001/0629/godbook.htm
or
http://www.brainconnection.com/content/174_1

This is going beyond the OBVIOUS evidence - that peoples always, in all the world, in all human history always hold some type of 'Faith' in something 'Spiritual'.

{Im not sure if Occam noticed that or what?]

Unfortunately for us - there are not too many 'Feral' Children to study, so its hard to say what happens if a human has absolutely no influence from the outside world.

BTW.. I disagree with your assertion that each human perspective is 'just as valid as any others'.
That is not necessarily so.
Some people have poor vision and their perspective is less valid than others with good vision eh?

BTWP2..... Dont think Im making an 'Appeal to Authority' argument for one theory or another Occam.
Im just pointing out that you are relatively unique in your belief that Faith is exclusive to conditioning.

Besides that, I do happen to agree with the majority (in this case) and not you.

 

BTW.. I disagree with your assertion that each human perspective is 'just as valid as any others'.
That is not necessarily so.
Some people have poor vision and their perspective is less valid than others with good vision eh?
Brocktoon

Totally disagree. Helen Keller could neither see nor hear, and you infer that therefore her perspective would be at the very bottom of the list of valid perspectives. I say she had a perspective that is hard to criticise. It is one that all people would do well to learn about, even you.
I have a harder time accepting that my views are anywhere near as valid as hers, but I do, humbly, and respectfully, believe they are.

Occam, you honour me by proclaiming that I am your friend. Thank you.

 

Oh BlackGuard.. *sigh*

Stick with the physical comparison... Helen Kellers Vision (or lack of) IS LESS VALID THAN SOMEONE WHO CAN SEE!!!!!!!!!!

Helen Keller WAS BLIND.

By definition her Sight is INVALID!!!!!!!!!!!!!
*Slaps BG13 with a Carp repeatedly*

...................
Stop and move to the SPIRITUAL COMPARISON
..................

Some people are very young, stupid and have no real experience dealing with Spiritual things.
In fact, they may have been raised to believe their is not such thing as 'Spirituality'.

I would NOT GIVE THEIR VIEWS on Spirituality and Faith AS MUCH credit as I would, sayyyy... The Dalai Lama, A Hindu Guru , the Pope or even someone who was simply willing to consider these things.

Helen Keller is NOT 'as good' as me at appraising colours.
In a 'Like' way
An Idiot Teen with no care about Faith is not 'equally valid' in their views on Faith as someone who practices Faith.

To put your own beliefs to the test...
Ask yourself if you think Brocktoons perceptions are Equally Valid to Occams?

Occam DOES NOT THINK BROCKTOONS BELIEFS ARE EQUALLY VALID TO HIS OWN!

 

you could have been more specific, brocktoon, rather than just say perspective.
Sure, a deaf person cannot hear, you are right. A blind one can't see, as you have concluded. You seem to have that concept down pat. I just didn't clue in to the fact that you were stating the painfully obvious, and still do not see the relevence of those points.

You put me to the test, yet you will not accept my answer.
Occam and I share far more similar beliefs than you and I do. I think that is quite clear. But, to answer your question,
'Ask yourself if you think Brocktoons perceptions are Equally Valid to Occams?'
Yes, as I have repeated ad nauseaum, all are equally valid........sigh.
This is possible since we all are experiencing different realities, and have unique life experiences, lessons to learn, and paths to follow. I cannot follow your path, nor you mine. Just because my path is nearer to Occam's than it is to yours, in no way invalidates your views.
They are the right ones for you, they are true, and they are no more or less valid than anyone else's, mine, Occam's, anyones.
You need not reply to say once again that I am wrong.......I heard you the first fifty times.

 

BG13.. sometimes you are just plain cute and funny !

 

There was a little old lady who was very spiritual who would step out on her porch every day, raise her arms to the sky and yell, "Praise the Lord."
One day, an atheist bought the house next door to her, and he became very irritated with the spiritual lady. So after a month or so of her yelling, "Praise the Lord" from her porch, he went outside on his porch and yelled back, "There is no Lord."
Yet, the little old lady continued.
One cold, wintry day, when the little old lady couldn't get to the store, she went out on her porch, raised her hands up to the sky and said, "Help me Lord, I have no more money, it's cold, and I have no more food."
The next morning, she went outside, and there were three bags of food on the porch, enough to last her a week. "Praise the Lord," she yelled.
The Atheist stepped out from the bushes and said, "There is no Lord hahaha, I bought those groceries!"
(Hold on...the ending is pretty good!).


The little old lady raised her arms to the sky and said, "Praise the Lord, you sent me groceries and you made the Devil pay for them!"

A college professor, an avowed Atheist, was teaching his class. He shocked several of his students when he flatly stated he was going to
prove there was no God. Addressing the ceiling he shouted: "God, if you are real, then I want you to knock me off this platform. I'll give you 15 minutes!"

The lecture room fell silent. You could have heard a pin fall. Ten minutes went by. Again he taunted God, saying, "Here I am, God. I'm still waiting."

His countdown got down to the last couple of minutes when a Marine - just released from active duty and newly registered in the class - walked up to the professor, hit him full force in the face, and sent him tumbling from his lofty platform. The professor was out cold!
At first, the students were shocked and babbled in confusion. The young Marine took a seat in the front row and sat silent. The class fell silent...waiting.

Eventually, the professor came to, shaken. He looked at the young Marine in the front row. When the professor regained his senses and could
speak he asked: "What's the matter with you? Why did you do that?"

"God was busy. He sent me."

 

I love that last story LMAO... I expected this was the 'Unbreakable Chalk Stick' story LOL!

Good Stuff!

 

There was a huge flood and as the town was evacuated, one man stayed behind. When the water was a foot deep, an army truck made one last pass through the streets. They called him to jump aboard, but he replied, "I am not worried, God will save me."

Well, the water rose to 10 feet, and a boat showed up. Seeing him at his second floor window, they implored him to come aboard, but he still replied, " God will save me. "

Later, as the water reached the roof, a rescue helicopter showed up and lowered a rope to him, as he was now on the roof. He refused it, still stating, " God will save me."

The waters rose up over the roof, and he was washed away and drowned. He went to heaven, and when he saw God, he asked Him why He did not save him.



God replied, " I sent you a truck, a boat, a helicopter......"


A man asked God, " Is it not true that a million dollars is like a penny to You?"

God replied " Yes, just as a million years is like a second."

The man continued "Well, could You send me a penny then?"

God answered back, " Certainly, my son, just a second."

 

This last joke shows how annoying God is. Just like God to tease children...

 

Nicely said! Or as a cliche "hard to judge without walking in their shoes"

 

A Christian was out hunting one day when a huge Grizzly came out of the woods right in front of him. He backed up and got his rifle up to his eye just as the bear was coming at him. Pulled the trigger.....nothing, checked the safety, off, pulled again, again no go. His gun had jammed and he was cornered against a cliff. The bear swatted the gun away, knocked him to the ground and sat on his chest, licking his lips.

The hunter prayed to God in desperation, "Please let this grizzly bear be a Christian, God, I beg you."
The bear leaned back and lifted his paws off the man's shoulders.
Then he put them together, bent his head down, and growled "Dear Lord, thank you for this food that you have provided for me to eat today. Amen."

 

In a world of individuals, comparison is ludicrous.
Live and let live.
Jack Handy said something similar I think. "Before you judge someone, walk a mile in his shoes.........then you're a mile away, and you have his shoes."

 

Jack Handy Reference Earns BlackGuard Some Karma!

 

So what is a Stuart Smalley quote worth?

"It is easier to put on slippers than to try to carpet the world."

I think I recall you aren't a big fan of Franken, but you must admit the old Franken and Davis stuff was pretty good.

 

I've read most of this thread with much interest as I have been trying to define my spirituality these days and I cannot offer any insight on par with the knowledge and education of you two. But I can tell you how I stumbled on the spiritual path I have led. I was raised surrounded by Southern Baptists and was attempted to be "saved" by them many, many, many times. A very pushy bunch with the reasoning that they must be that way because of their higher purpose, right? Once, while trying to get me to come and get baptized in their church / religion (accousted in public, btw), I told them that I had been baptized. These representatives of the Baptist church said if I was not baptized in their religion that I would go to hell. I asked what happened to the North American Indians before this religion was brought to them. They go to their own heaven was the answer given by these young people, full of faith. I decided then and there that the "Indian's heaven" was for me, too.